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    cartag closed #1059
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    cartag closed #1049
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    cartag commented #1049
tekton
@tekton
A purge is still a form of that technically, but yes it does have to be actual copy/paste
Wouldn’t that be the same concern as Imperial lists in 40k right now?
OftKilted
@OftKilted
Dunno.... but potentially.
So, how is that being handled in the imperial 40k lists?
And where there are battalions that have cross allegiance units
tekton
@tekton
Child detachments under a randomly chosen “main” faction detachment
OftKilted
@OftKilted
However the main faction in this case is the key piece. And we will likely get folks asking “where is Unit x”
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Azyr has 33 allegiances for Chaos. However, a number of them are effectively duplicates (we don't need separate Khorne, Khorne Bloodbound, Daemons of Khorne)
and I would likely leave the small factions (monsters of Chaos, Warherds, Thunderscorn) in a single file, as (I assume) they are vanishingly unlikely to be chosen as main Allegiances.
Skaven could in theory also be a single file, which brings the list down to about 10-12
OftKilted
@OftKilted
Technically all of the separate Khorne allegiances are all “Khorne” and could be included in a “Khorne Army”
We need to have the answer to “If there isn’t battleline” where does it go? Do you split Pestilins out, include it in Nurgle
As examples
As Pestilins could be included in both a Skaven Army, and a Nurgle Army.
As core forces, not even Allies.
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
only in Open or Narrative. In Matched they are not Allies of Maggotkin.
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
so you can't have a "Nurgle" allegiance army with Pestilens allies. You can however, have a Pestilens army with "Nurgle" allies.
OftKilted
@OftKilted
So ... there is a Nurgle Allies.
Pestilins have the Nurgle keyword. The Maggotkin books refer to “Nurgle Allies” not “Maggotkin Allies”
OftKilted
@OftKilted
While Pestillins has their own Allegiance, they also qualify for “Nurgle Allegiance”
So, you’re not actually including Pestillins as Allies ... they’re part of the main “Nurgle” force.
(Like a whole bunch of the Tamurkhan’s Horde units. Ignoring Sayl and Nightmaw)
OftKilted
@OftKilted
This is mainly an issue in Chaos ... but the new Death battletome LoN has a similar issue
OftKilted
@OftKilted
Most of the Pestillins units don’t have good synergy (and can’t be part of any Of the Maggotkin Warscroll Battalions ... but amusingly the Verminlord Corruptor has The Nurgle, Daemon, and Hero Keywords ... and could be put into at least the “Munificent Wanderers” battalion.
Rick Weyrauch
@rweyrauch
@/all what's the plan? Are separate catalogs the new plan? I agree that separate catalogs are an improvement. How close are we to releasing a set of useful (all be it not complete ) monolithic set of catalogs?
OftKilted
@OftKilted
Death has all the points in... and LoN/TK/VC all have profiles entered
FEC still needs profile entry. Then I’m digging into Artefacts/Spell Lores
But FEC is my next point for the monolithic keywords
Whee autocorrect. Catalog
I know that Chaos and Order are not in a solid state.
They’re officially the largest of the catalogs.
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Chaos is maybe 60% done? Order probably less so.
Rick Weyrauch
@rweyrauch
Order is missing a lot of validation, but most of the units have had their points and abilities updated. Is it worth it to continue with the current plan and release something or do we start again with the multi-catalog approach?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
I still have Slaanesh, Tzeentch, Nurgle and all the FW stuff to do. Skaven have profiles but not proper RSEs. 89 units are ready to go, 147 are in various states of disrepair.
OftKilted
@OftKilted
Before we go all-in on a new concept, I think we should do a quick prototype with actual data.
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
I'm just going to knock something up now.
OftKilted
@OftKilted
Chaos and death are the two that I could see causing issues. And my question is still on the What groupings do we want to do?
tekton
@tekton
Destruction is probably 80% or so at this point
Rick Weyrauch
@rweyrauch
A prototype that exercises all of the ideas, problems and solutions is very wise.
OftKilted
@OftKilted
So ... identified issues:
Battalions that cross catalogs (Sylvaneth & SCE battalions ... or mixed city battalions)
Rick Weyrauch
@rweyrauch
It may be best to finish up with the current plan and release something that is at least more useful than what currently exists.
OftKilted
@OftKilted
Units that can fit into multiple (potential) catalogs. Or can be cross compatible between allegiance due to keywords
Rick Weyrauch
@rweyrauch
0
Simon Barlow
@FreylisUK
@rweyrauch I'll finish up the KO tonight and then move onto the DoK. Based on the discussion today I'll enter the Battalions as we are currently doing them, i.e. as purely informational with no validation.
I feel like I've opened up a massive can of worms with my musings!
OftKilted
@OftKilted
@Cupropituvanso How are Sylvaneth coming?
So, Allegiance and Artefacts/Spell lists are being painful ... based on the current proposed solution for keyword basing ... due to keywords being assigned to units that don’t have them normally ...
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
If only keyword visibility actually worked. :(
Simon Barlow
@FreylisUK
I also agree that it might be best to finish up with the current plan given we're most of the way there. If we can get the data up-to-date and include validation at least on a per-unit level, the file will at least be useful for everyone. It also buys us some more time to work out the best way of implementing Battalions.
Also, I wonder if, from an end-user's point of view at least, it might make the most sense to only split out factions into separate catalogues if they have a Battletome? There's nothing stopping us keeping the Grand Alliance catalogues either, which would at least provides a sensible home for the minor factions that don't have their own books.
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
it's not so bad for Destruction and Order, because your allegiances are mostly nicely self-contained.