These are chat archives for BSData/wh40k

12th
Jan 2018
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 00:01
off to bed too, nn
flakpanda
@flakpanda
Jan 12 2018 00:47
Hey, it there a leak for CD yet,?
courtesy of skonk
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 04:35
I really could use an epub pool for the codex on saturday though
if @acebaur shows up :P
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 09:18
@GenWilhelm, you're right. I'm pretty sure that's how Loci should work, but GW have dropped the ball.
Much like how all the Herald abilities are missing the "friendly" restriction, so you currently buff your enemy's models.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 09:20
whats the matter with the wording?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 09:34
don't worry, I must have read it a bunch of times and just missed the word
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 14:58
Sloppity Bilepiper is a fantastic unit name
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:01
is it? is it though?
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Jan 12 2018 15:03
Yes
Earl Bishop
@DrTobogganMD
Jan 12 2018 15:03
It's really not. The only thing good about nurgle is ambitious nurglings who aspire to be more than little balls of snot.
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Jan 12 2018 15:03
Yes it is
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:04
I suppose it is at least pronounceable.
I mean, how are you supposed to pronouce Aetaos'rau'keres
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 15:05
with great difficulty
Earl Bishop
@DrTobogganMD
Jan 12 2018 15:06
A-Taus-Rau-Care-Ees
I've watched Always sunny for a long time. I'm well versed in both bird names and bird law.
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:07
:)
@GenWilhelm, found anything else yet?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 15:09
other than the comment on #2183?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:09
oh, that comment!
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 15:10
managed to get through HQs on my lunch break :D
i'll take a look at the rest later
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:10
Why can't Blue Scribes take a relic?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 15:11
theyre a named character
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:11
D'oh!
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 15:21
Reading #2211 makes my brain hurt. A lot. WTF.
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 15:27
The Allegiance filtering on Daemons makes it so much easier to do the detachments
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Jan 12 2018 15:27

I'm not an old cranky BIRD!
I'm old, I'm cranky but definately NOT a bird.

TBH though I currently have a very low energy phase... deep troubles with GF and I suspect my old friend depression is kind of rearing it's head a bit. Passion for 40k is on an all time low currently. Will pass over I'm sure.
As to why DA is so bad... I only can imagine that it's partly me not building a list since the new codex and therefore missing a lot of bugs personally and trying to do some UX improvements which led to some hasty errors...

I'll go over the bugs, should be a things of minutes at most.
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:35
@crusherjoe, We know that the weapon options in SW are a bit of a mess.
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Jan 12 2018 15:38
There, 3 bugs dead.
The LC one is a bit tricky, I'll have to reexamine every entry that can take LCs. due to the way I structured it... meh bleh bah!
ew!
LC are set to 6.5 pts in the gst if 2 are taken... that nasty
do LC pairs cost 13 in other dexes?
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Jan 12 2018 15:46
C:SM lists them as 8/12.. anyone mind if I change the modifier from 6.5 to 6?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:47
AFAIK, Wolves are the only army still using the 8/13 pts cost, because they didn't get updated in CA.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 15:49
wolves use wolf claws instead dont they?
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 15:49
Yeah different item
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 15:50
so yeah, as of CA everyone should be using 8/12pts for their l-claws
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Jan 12 2018 15:54
off it goes then!
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 15:56
I'm pretty sure Wolves can still take lightning claws instead.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 15:59
yeah they can, but they use space marines points values
idk what the codex v index protocol is there
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 16:01
Really, it should only be where the unit is pulled from Index and has been replaced in Codex, but, it's a single point right?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 16:02
yeah, index cost is 9/13
wolf guard currently have it as 8/13
well, 8/12 now with that GST change
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Jan 12 2018 16:05
it would rather be prudent to change ots in c:sw than everywhere else...
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 16:06
absolutely. and this is the exact reason i stayed away from imperium and chaos catalogues
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 16:09
Okay that's all the SW bugs except for #2211
I'm pretty sure 8/12 is the correct cost for LCs
And you're right, SW can take LC or WC
Sorry my brain wasn't quite in gear
Too much blood in my caffeine stream
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 16:10
@GenWilhelm, I've fixed all the issues you added. The Chanting Horrors need an FAQ, but I've changed it to 5pts on the basis that fewer ppl will complain about the cheaper cost.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 16:12
i think it's pretty clear, since it's no longer three horrors but simply "chanting horrors"
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Jan 12 2018 16:14
@Thairne I’m sorry to hear that man
I know you’re an old pro at this, hence my confusion on the amount of bugs
Wasn’t trying to needle you (excessively)
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 16:16
@GenWilhelm, yes, but the Burning Chariot datasheet says that a Burning Chariot "can also ridden by 3 Chanting Horrors". So it sounds like you have to pay for 3?
I'm pretty certain they meant the upgrade to be 5 pts, but it's just sloppy.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 16:18
it doesnt specify 3 anymore
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 16:19
it does on the actual Burning Chariot.
not on the Fateskimmer.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 16:19
ooooh, i havent read that far
so the fateskimmer pays 5, and the chariot pays 15?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 16:20
like I said, sloppy. Same as the Slaanesh claw relic can only be taken by SLAANESH HERALDs, but there's no way to get that keyword combo anymore.
because they changed HERALD to HERALD OF SLAANESH.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 16:22
wow yeah, that is an oversight
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 16:22
the Index Slaanesh Heralds can take it though :)
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 16:23
nah, its been HERALD OF SLAANESH since the index
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 16:23
Right, I'm going home. if you find anything else, I'll fix it later.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 16:23
:+1:
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 19:21
So @ilaunchbury you were right about index DP not being able to be taken by deathguard, but for an entirely different reason
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 19:21
?
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 19:21
the replacing datasheet has <legion> and the CSM codex expressly forbids that from being replaced with death guard
while the index allowed it
ran across that while fucking about with multi detachments and thousand sons
which is why 1ks can't take them either at the moment, technically
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 19:23
Not long for the Codex!
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 19:24
but it means DG needs an edit and @crusherjoe gets the satisfaction of being right, even if the reasoning was not correct :p
Sadly the renaming problem doesn't die with it
but what can you do
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 19:28
I'm still not convinced there not a loophole because the model/unit is a Death Guard Daemon Prince which will still use the Index datasheet because it's not part of CSM. The CSM version can't apply to DG because they are different Codexes.
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 19:29
The death guard index points to the CSM DP
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 19:30
I'm sure GW will tidy it up for us at some point.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 21:25
@ilaunchbury last few thing i found are in #2183. turns out HQs are most of the codex
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 21:40
Done. Merged. :ship:
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:41
Wooo
Of all the things I like
I like being right the most
But I can't really say I was right -- @WindstormSCR is right my reasoning wasn't correct
I was... "correct", but not "right"
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 21:42
I'm guessing we shouldn't really ship Codex Daemons before it's released?
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:42
@ilaunchbury minor thing, but we are tagging units that are index only options with (index)
I think that only affects slaanesh HQs
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 21:43
are we now? When did we decide that? I'll need to go through CSM.
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:43
example autarch with warp gen
around the time of craftworlds, because of people being dumb about index vs codex
and fully decided when the flowchart appeared
@CrusherJoe so a thing that's worth mentioning
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:45
Can we also have the software deliver a barely non-lethal shock when they attempt to select some Index-y thing for the purposes of cheesemongering?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 21:45
the Warp Jump Autarch isn't flagged as Index? Some of his wargear is, but not the unit.
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:45
You know, like a shock collar
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:45
CSM horrors are not actually replaced by GW's own rules, since only index is superseded by codex. you might want to put 'use the CD datasheet' in your tournament rules pack
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:45
Eventually train them out of using old shit
.....
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:46
I expect when the FAQ drops they'll nerfbat CSM horrors appropriately, but just in case
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 21:46
^^ this
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:46
Good catch there
I was thinking about that earlier honestly
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:47
@ilaunchbury if he isn't then he should be
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:47
I'm not going to play vs. a Daemon player until the FAQ drops anyway
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:47
I'll have to edit that later
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 21:47
Any way. Someone push a release later, say 11:55pm, and we'll see how many people raise issues before updating their data.
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:47
@Thairne you alright with me poking at the remaining DA bugs? not sure if you were still working in the file
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 21:48
@WindstormSCR, if we're flagging Index only units now then it needs to go in the guidelines.
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:48
yeah, I don't think it ever got put on there
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:48
Because I'm 98% certain GW is going to rapidly apply the "Stop Trying To Cheat, You Wanks" bat to the whole "Herpy-derp, let's deep strike in Mangnus and Mortarion and a Lord of Skulls" nonsense
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 21:49
ITC guys are already saying they will "Don't come to LVO assuming that will work... etc"
good news is it might still work on anggrath, which is about the only way he'll ever be worth 888pts
and if someone wants to spend half a list to DS that giant hunk of mostly-useless resin that dies as easy as a 300pt primarch? almost a free win
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:51
I'd rather drop in 80 bloodletters
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Jan 12 2018 21:51
@alphalas you didn't. All is fine, I'm confused as well. Just sloppy and a bit rushed work this time. As you (it was you?) already said - loads of shared and collective.
I also found that a few BS bugs work against me.. I like to use "model" instead of a specific entry like "hellblaster", and that sometimes breaks albeit it shouldnt.
Causes some PL issues.
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 21:52
Is the Daemons.cat file in Master the final release version?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 21:55
Yes, I just merged it.
It's as final as it's going to be tonight.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 21:56
itshappening.mp4
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:02
I thought there was a "god switch" in there somewhere? Or was that just discussed and not implemented?
CrusherJoe @CrusherJoe is totally NOT making a Slaanesh daemon list. Nope.
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Jan 12 2018 22:04
them diazettes lol
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:04
dem diazettes tho
LOL
NOPE
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 22:04
There is? Chaos Allegiance? Should be a min 1 on the roster?
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:05
I am TOTALLY NOT falling to Chaos.
The Allegiance filtering on Daemons makes it so much easier to do the detachments
@skonk mentioned it
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 22:06
you have actually synced with master, yes?
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:07
Supposedly, yes
v23
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 22:07
v25 it should be
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:08
Ah now it's right
HUH
Github didn't sync it as of about 15 minutes ago
CrusherJoe @CrusherJoe shrugs
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Jan 12 2018 22:08
It was only merged 27 mins ago.
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:13
@CrusherJoe if you're going daemonettes, get some khorne in there as well
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:13
Oh indeed @WindstormSCR
The Sex & Death List lol
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:13
bloodletter bomb to tie up the chaff and clear it, the seekers/daemonettes as a second wave
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:14
Haemotophilia
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:14
optionally use mass daemonettes and DS some bloodcrushers
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:14
Is there any reason to NOT take Skarbrand?
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:14
No
well, sort of
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 22:14
he's not Your Dude
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:15
he can't 3d6 charge
also that
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 22:15
yeah, only the letters can get that sweet 3d6
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:15
the equivalent points in bloodcrushers can tie up a LOT of stuff, and seriously threaten vehicles
no, crushers can
:D
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:16
oh
Skarbrand can't fly
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Jan 12 2018 22:16
you know you want those diazettes @CrusherJoe
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:16
9 bloodcrushers for 2 CP, do eeeet
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Jan 12 2018 22:16
no khorne ripped hiw wings off
His*
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 22:17
oh i made big assumptions about the icon stratagems. time to read them again
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Jan 12 2018 22:18
@CrusherJoe time to impliment #1840
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:19
?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 22:19
brood brothers
ie. hide the regiment-specific characters
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Jan 12 2018 22:20
it was the BCB bug we left open because it was actually valid and doesn’t cause us to break anything
was just backburnered because BCB
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:20
BCB?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Jan 12 2018 22:21
he who shall not be named
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:40
interestingly, with the codex: tzeentch SC built as a herald chariot and exalted flamer is 487. while the khorne SC built a similar way is only 367
slaanesh SC built as two separate chariots instead of 1 exalted is 394
and poor nurgle only clocks in at 296
kind of interesting to see the splits
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:44
SC?
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:44
Start Collecting
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:44
oh
nurgle one could do with re-doing now they have some new units
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:44
the tzeentch and slaanesh ones are mega $$$ value, khorne is decent, the nurgle one is crappy
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:44
throw some beasts of nurgle in there
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:45
the best part about the tzeentch one is you can use the spare screamer tails from the screamer sprues on the chariot screamers if you don't build either chariot type
then just use the disc for a disc herald or a CSM sorc
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:46
yeh
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:46
since it's the only index unit that has a real purpose (mobile sorc with an actual invuln)
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:46
Well it's actually super easy to build a 12 CP Khorne/Slaanesh list
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:47
think i have 2 tzeentch SC boxes built and some individual kits
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:47
yeah, since you want max troops
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:47
so ended up with 3 heralds, 3 chariots (flamers), 6 sceamers etc
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:47
I've got 1 built and two unbuilt
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:47
Including a Bloodthirster on Insensate Rage and a Keeper of Secrets
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:47
I just don't see the point in the burning chariot
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:48
fills a heavy support
is one possible reason
the screamers can attack again (dont think they could in 7th?)
or in 8th maybe before the dexc
cant remember
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:48
8th they could
not sure about 7th
nope, they couldn't in 7th
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:50
id use the chariots like i use bloat drones in my DG army
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:50
something as a distraction?
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:50
yeh
get up in their face, flame something and then get em charged in
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Jan 12 2018 22:51
That lets me drop the Bloodthirster, Skulltaker, 60 Bloodletters and the Keeper of Secrets and have 4 CP left to play with LOL
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:51
well, that would make sense if they weren't a lascannon equivalent
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:51
difference is these can potentially be doing str 10 stops at -4 ap and d3 damage
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:51
they're more like a predator
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:51
but u dont need to shoot the unit they charge like
the other nice thing is while its in combat it can still shoot its d6 shot pistol version of its attack
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:52
my main issue is the exalted flamer w/o chariot is still 10" move, has character protections, only 1 less T, and is 30pts less
the only thing the chariot gives you is making you easier to shoot, T5 instead of T4, and slightly faster move
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:53
pretty plop melee ability tho
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:53
and once in combat that lascannon can't hit jack
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:53
chariot gets the 6 screamer attacks
the las has a pistol profile
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:54
fair, but I could be doing the same thing with a herald chariot and buffing the nearby screamers + itself :P
no, lascannon equivalent is heavy, the pistol one is str:u and -2 ap
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:54
its basically a 12 inch flamer but usable in combat
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:55
same as the regular flamer daemons
which is why I'd rather run the herald up the board behind some screamers and flamers
because unlike the BC, the herald chariot keeps the character protections
and is <10 wounds
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 22:56
it does but i see the chariot version as having a different use to the other stuff
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Jan 12 2018 22:57
I'll give you that the BC's screamer attacks are more effective because of the better WS
but the lack of character protections means anyone who has any idea of what it does is going to remove it first
tbh it SHOULD have the same protections, since the herald does
but gw
and the exalted on a base is a character
the other use I can think of for a fateskimmer (chariot herald) is to give the guy the soul bane dagger, and punch through something with a good invuln
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 23:05
it may be a mistake and they'l errata it in
but in most cases i dont think id use em in a way that having the rule would make much diff other than it giving it's self the locus (the miss thing)
James
@skonk
Jan 12 2018 23:35
@ilaunchbury just noticed the Burning Chariot has the Character category but in the dex they didnt give it the Character keyword for some reason