These are chat archives for BSData/wh40k

7th
May 2018
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 06:39
@Kohato Hurrhurr.
On a more serious note, I get the DA schism, despite it being pretty old and actually proven to be false in 30k. In 40k, its pretty rough considering what pretty every chapter except Salamanders do, but I KIND of get why.
Alpha Legion I still don't get behind... as intended.
Last bit of true lore I read in HH is that the AL wants humanity excinct so chaos dies out, bereft of "fuel". And guess who got that idea in their heads? Eldar. So while they join with Chaos to fight Chaos, does that not STILL make them traitors? Causing humanity to go exctinct looks pretty traitorly to me.
Now Cypher is a different thing, that guy truly is ambiguous and more AL than the AL itself.
Amadeusz Sadowski
@amis92
May 07 2018 07:38
Can someone lay it out to me? What's the schism actually about, how was it proven false in 30k, what does every chapter except Salamanders do and why...?
Like, flat and simple :D
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 07:57

ok.. :P
Well in 30k, The Lion has been written to be fiercely loyal in the Horus Heresy Novels. He came to Macragge to kick Guilimans butt since he thought emp dead and was of the oppinion that noone should wield that power except Emps himself. There are other quotes from him like when he charged a battle line bringing a world into compliance doing a ritual muttering to himself like "one more world for you father.. one more world". He also fucked over Corax when that one confronted him with a vision of his future about a doubt in his loyalty with which the Lion responded with ramming his sword through him telling him he doesnt care, since "Loyality is it's own reward".

In 40k, the DA have some older fluff which connect them to some disappearings of loyal forces after they got a sniff of the Fallen. No downright proof though, some abandonment of battle lines when Fallen were sighted etc.

Compared to, lets say, Blood Angels which go berserk and slaughter Guardsmen or Space Wolves which open fire on Sisters and Inquisition ships thats nothing too special.
Salamanders are the goodiest of the SM with their "Protecting the people"-Shtick, so I excluded them :P

correction: not corax, the night haunter. I get creepy shadowdudes confused sometimes :P
Amadeusz Sadowski
@amis92
May 07 2018 08:00

So it's like, DAs kill friends when they see the Fallen.

And the Fallen are possibly another fraction of DAs?

Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:01
oh you don't know that part?
Amadeusz Sadowski
@amis92
May 07 2018 08:02
Not really, I've only read part of the Gathering Storm where he's all darkish and rather cool, saving the party from these Chaos marines on some space fortress...?
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:02
in 30k, a good chunk of DA turned traitor under the rule of The Lion's 2nd in command, Luther.
When the primarch came back to Caliban, he got attacked and in a mirror of Emps/Horus, he killed a chaos beefed up Luther and got wounded in the process.
Caliban got destroyed by warp powers and the traitor DA's got scattered through time and space to be then known as the Fallen
Amadeusz Sadowski
@amis92
May 07 2018 08:03
Oh and also, he wanted to talk with Emp but Guilliman didn't allow him in spite of the promise.
Oooh
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:03
the DA's consider that to be ahuge stain on their honor noone must know of and have a really hard one for finding those guys to make them "repent"
Cypher is a mysterious figure that once was a title from the time of pre-Imperium Caliban.
Amadeusz Sadowski
@amis92
May 07 2018 08:04
So, Fallen are just bad period, but Cypher is no-one-knows what allegiance?
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:05
the stain thing is funny since the White Scars had pretty much the same shit going on half of them were about to join Horus since the Khan was missing a few weeks
He came back just in time to rattle some heads, otherwise the same would have happened to the Scars :P
well "bad" is not that accurate
some are assholes, some turned to chaos, but some have seen the error in their ways and try to live a "normal" live as a space marine
Amadeusz Sadowski
@amis92
May 07 2018 08:05
Luther. I love how the wh fluff makes nice parallels with names...
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:06
like entering the Deathwatch as a Black Shield, which is a theory that some found a way there
Amadeusz Sadowski
@amis92
May 07 2018 08:06
Exactly my thought.
Ha
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:06
what Cypher is all about we do not know, he sometimes helps the Imperium and blows up a imperial space ship a second later
all we know is that he has The Lion's Sword he wants to bring to Big E for unkown reasons
but in the meantime we know that after Lion'el was mortally wounded he gave a last command to a mysterious figure which then picked up his sword...
Amadeusz Sadowski
@amis92
May 07 2018 08:07
But he actually got pretty close to the Golden Throne, I think that says quite a lot.
Damn. Nice, that's nice.
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:08
yup, he's a very capable lad, appearing all around the galaxy
DA fluff can be very nice, it really has some secrets to dig into
Luther was captured and kept in the Rock for 10k years, being made mad and gibbering about the Lion returning and aquiring his forgiveness
He's been used be the Supreme Grand Masters as some kind of Oracle in his clearer moment... but since the Fall of Cadia, he somehow escaped his confiment...
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:15
and that's the irony, the DA's are really focused on purging traitors and especially the Fallen and yet are called traitors in disguise because they value killing those guys more than saving others.
with the old, now outdated/retconned fluff of the Lion dragging his feet back to Terra to see who would win
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 08:25
(which actually was Russ' fault)
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
May 07 2018 09:51

REMEMBERTHEOPHIDIUMGULF

Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
May 07 2018 10:09
Y’know, the time the DA made a whole crusade of BT disappear because of a “supposed fallen”
@Kohato had a chance to work on that 30k file yet?
Earl Bishop
@DrTobogganMD
May 07 2018 10:42
I have not. God of War has had its clutches in me
Unlike Thairne, I'm rather enjoying this one
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
May 07 2018 11:12
Dad of boy worth picking up for someone who’s never played any of the GoWs?
Earl Bishop
@DrTobogganMD
May 07 2018 11:13
Ever play darksiders?
*Enjoy darksiders
In short yes, it is. It's a pretty good bonding story, requires no knowledge of the other GoWs, but benefits if you know a a bit about kratos
Supporting cast is great, I love it
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
May 07 2018 11:24
:+1:
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
May 07 2018 11:38
I... have to admit that the game is.. fairly great.
its pretty... fun and... brilliant.
just not a classical GOW
but without that inheritance it is GOTY material
I spent a few hours yesterday beating the crap out of some valkyries (read: I got the shit stomped out of me because the margin of error on those is pretty slim)
Id recommend at least watching a YouTube vid on the lore from the previous games tho. Otherwise you'd be a bit "huh?" at some points.
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
May 07 2018 23:11
Sooooo..... #3000
There's really not a way to do that without defining Regiment for individual officers/characters
(well...and still make a valid list, anyway)
Craig Sniffen
@MasterSlowPoke
May 07 2018 23:23
Is the repo not showing up on the main battlescribe data index page for anyone else?
Or am I having some weird phone issues
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
May 07 2018 23:27
It might have fallen off again
That’s nothing new or unusual
It just usually only happens after a release
Craig Sniffen
@MasterSlowPoke
May 07 2018 23:33
Gotcha. I'm not on here too much anymore but got a wild hair to point up a list
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
May 07 2018 23:52
Yeah it failed to update for me earlier