These are chat archives for BSData/wh40k

5th
Dec 2018
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 05:38
Considering AdMech are supposedly getting "drops almost across the board" I'm guessing it's not even close
tekton
@tekton
Dec 05 2018 05:49
i'm still not sure that's enough of a point drop for land raiders
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Dec 05 2018 05:59
it is if weapons are dropping as well
tekton
@tekton
Dec 05 2018 05:59
still not sure...
the redeemer is actually more interesting at that point level though
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Dec 05 2018 06:01
twin lcs from 50 > 40 that shaves 20 off, chassis down to 200 shaves another 40, then any change to twin AC cuts even further
tekton
@tekton
Dec 05 2018 06:01
it helps, but we'll see what else drops
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Dec 05 2018 06:01
so at the minimum they went from ~350 to 290, crusader and redeemer could be even steeper
60 pts is a healthy drop, kit for a squad
GKTs getting a drop also helps them a fair bit
tekton
@tekton
Dec 05 2018 06:02
i would love to be able to field 2+ land raiders again, but just because they're cheaper doesn't mean the mechanics and changes to army comp due to point changes mean it's going to be on the field again
I totally didn't just update a branch with the rumors points to see what i could field...
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Dec 05 2018 06:03
I've had decent success fielding mine with deathwatch, and I'm considering 2 now that the crusader is looking at a significant reduction
tekton
@tekton
Dec 05 2018 06:06
the other models in deathwatch give you enough bodies and threats that land raiders do work well, so i can see that...GK don't really have that at the moment, but could after this
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 08:48

....but just because they're cheaper doesn't mean the mechanics and changes to army comp due to point changes mean it's going to be on the field again

So much this, not sure if it was one of you guys that posted this recently but it bears repeating ..

My fear is that certain good units go up in price, and other less good tax units come down .. so that the overall cost of my list remains the same ... my components cost differently but I'm left with the same list

Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 08:58
I think in the CA18 preview they said that they wanted to bring the bad stuff up in value and leave the good stuff where it is
except the obvious miscreants ofc
I mean knights were said to not get hit except the castellan for a bit
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 09:09
2 more weeks .... I need something to occupy my mind for 2 more weeks ....
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 09:14
not a single leak mentions Tyranid models either .. I'm hoping for fexes and trygons and stuff to get a bit of a reduction
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 09:14
rumors were that those big gribblies went down 30pts a pop on avg
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 09:14
(where 'Stuff' = everything I own, obviously!)
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 09:14
if I remember right
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 09:15
commence gleeful hand rubbing
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 09:46
as long as that is the only thing you gleefully rub...
CloverFox
@CloverFox
Dec 05 2018 10:59
i hope farsights 8 are less than 1300, then you can take the 8 and a brigade for 2k points =)
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 11:04
farsight is 150pts iirc, so if we assume that's the average (what with there being a riptide and a broadside), then they're looking to be in the 1200 range
but then again i have no idea what their special rules or weapon loadouts are, so it's hard to say if it would be more or less than that
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 11:21
Loads of other content in this year’s Chapter Approved is designed to be compatible with matched play too, like the Eight – Commander Farsight’s elite unit of battlesuit-armoured heroes. Taken as a single Lord of War choice and costing over 1000 points, the Eight are awesome
not that "over 1000 points" is in anyway specific
I must have read it as around 1000 originally
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 11:24
1,000,000 pts is over 1000 :smile:
I suspect they'll be in the 1100-1200 pt range?
Or you might get lucky and they're like 1,005 points.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 11:26
i'm starting to think 1200 is a low estimate
a basic iontide is about 280pts, and a missile broadside is 140. if you round that up to 500pts for those two to account for character rules, better characteristics, unique wargear, etc., then add on 150 for farsight, that's 650. you then have another 5 guys who are a mix of commanders and veteran bodyguards
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 11:45
you're probably right. Building them as per the description on 1d4chan, they are 1086pts excluding Farsight. So by the time you've stuck in some special Signatures and character powers, 1200 is probably not a bad estimate.
CloverFox
@CloverFox
Dec 05 2018 11:49
ah i forgot some were bodyguards not commanders
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 11:50
All but 1 are Commanders in the fluff, but that doesn't necessarily mean they'll be "Commanders".
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 11:52
one of them is a "subcommander", one is a Shas'Vre, and another is an "Honour-Shas'Vre"
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 11:52
i dont count good
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 11:53
those last two are the broadside and the riptide
idk what "subcommander" means though
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 11:54
obviously the commander of a tau submarine
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 11:54
:laughing:
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 11:54
nono .. he's the Subway commander
"eat Flesh!"
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 11:54
lmao. was about to make a quip about sub sandwiches as well :smile:
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 11:55
I'm now hungry :(
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 11:55
I suspect he's really a Shas'el.
Which is one down from Shas'O
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 11:55
yeah, it's a shame they removed that distinction in the rules
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 11:55
which is one down from Sh'art?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 11:55
or are normal commanders Shas'El?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 11:56
shas'el is either a low rank commander, or a veteran bodyguard
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 11:56
I think bodyguard are 'Vre
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 11:56
@Thairne which is why he's with Farsight in the first place .. no-one trusts a Sh'art!
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 11:56
xD
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 11:57
the details are fuzzy, so i'd have to check my codex, but i'm like 75% sure you could take 'els in bodyguard teams
(i'm talking about 4e btw)
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Dec 05 2018 12:00
Let me go blow the dust off my 4e dex and I’ll find out
Iirc el was just the lesser commander
CloverFox
@CloverFox
Dec 05 2018 12:01
i don't think so, otherwise you could have a shas'el leading a shas'el leading a bodyguard
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 12:03
@alphalas, I have a PDF, what are we looknig for?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 12:04
the bodyguard datasheet
is there a profile for 'el, or only 'vre?
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 12:04
only vre in the bodyguard, Commanders are 'El or 'O
Jon Kissinger
@alphalas
Dec 05 2018 12:05
That’s what I thought
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 12:05
okay, cool. must have been mis-remembering
seems like sub-commander is just the rank name for a shas'el then
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 12:08
I guess so
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 12:09
so that would make it 2x 'vre, 1x 'el, 5x 'o
i wonder if bravestorm will be there, given that he's supposed to be dead
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 12:14
an extra ~70 points to make them all the "correct" rank then.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 13:19
LET THEM SEE OUR ADVANCE, LET THEM TREMBLE
that mission looks like it could be fun :smile:
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 13:30
distraction carnifex in mission form
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 13:42
Battle Honours - "You like Kill Team, here have some KT in 40k!"
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 13:42
lol. was thinking pretty much the same
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 13:47
aint this years CA CA18?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 13:48
yeah, Chapter Approved 2018
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 13:48
grafik.png
timey wimey obbly wobbly
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 13:48
:thinking:
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 13:49
sorry, narrative next year.
aw they fixed it xD
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 13:49
fast as duck
tbh, it did feel weird telling people to check CA2017 for the entirety of 2018
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 13:51
I literally had to do it today on a ticket.
I've got to hand it to GW Customer Services, they get the job done :smile:
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 13:52

especially nice with that comment below

I'm sure I'm not the first to ask, but has the team considered naming the book for the year it is active in? So next Chapter Approved would be 2020, and would be in effect for the whole of 2020.
That might get confusing as we'll have had two years of Chapter Approved being produced as it is, and could get especially confusing when it comes to the print dates of points and which are the most up to date!

Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 13:53
My Blackstone rulebook was misprinted, sent them some pics and proof-of-purchase, new book in the post!
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 14:00
say what you like about GW, but their customer service has always been top notch
and yeah, Dirk, ship has sailed and all that
i still very clearly remember, a long time ago, i bought a ravener that turned out to not have the correct bits (two sets of left arms, and no right arms). took it back to the shop the next week and the manager just picked another one off the shelf and handed it to me
needless to say that made my week :smile:
Earl Bishop
@DrTobogganMD
Dec 05 2018 14:23
Ya know what's fuckin awesome?
This day of Mourning for 41
Paid federal day off in the middle of the week :p
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 15:23
In classic GW style, the new Roster builder for Kill Team is riddled with bugs on release.
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 15:26
"What's QA?"
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 15:27
QA is releasing it and waiting for ppl to complain?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 15:28
ah, the old "Why pay people to do QA when the community will do if for free?"
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 15:31
so, in addition to incorrect specialisms, for bonus fun, try adding an Intercessor Sgt.
some imperials tomorrow
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 15:45
i love how people are already writing these off, despite having only seen half of what they do
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 15:48
the servitor maniple effect :P
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Dec 05 2018 15:57
Wraith host detachment? much excite!
Iain Launchbury
@Mad-Spy
Dec 05 2018 15:59
looks halfway decent
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Dec 05 2018 16:02
I need more wraithblades
the 5 I have have always done decent work
but that stratagem, plus charge, plus psytronome?
that's 40 attacks on the charge from 5 axe/board blades
50 for ghostsword blades
base 2, 1 for fires, 1 for host, then doubled :D
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 16:07
just to allay any fears - Specialist Detachments can be freely used in open, narrative and matched play in any setting
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 16:10
and there was much rejoicing
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 16:11
Crickets
still being punished for our Decurion days
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 16:12
not a single leak mentions Tyranid models either .. I'm hoping for fexes and trygons and stuff to get a bit of a reduction
Man I'm hurt. It's not like I didn't splash the bug rumors I had here.
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 16:13
sorry Joe ... I sometimes get this random guy stood behind me looking at my screen over my shoulder ... fricken weirdo doesn't like me lurking here .. so I miss things ..
did I miss a tasty thing ?
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 16:14
Well if you scoll up (waaaaay up, like from this weekend) you'll see what I did the copypasta on
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 16:15
Some leaks about Nids if anyone cares:
swarmy 250 now
neuro got nerfed 90 pts now
all the big unplayed bugs dropped about 30 pts
broodlords are 115 now
151 pts for a Tfex before guns
170 for Haruspex
150 for mal
140 for toxi
lictors only 30 pts now
and pyros only 25
harpys might be good down 45 pts
oooh cheap Broodlords
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 16:16
There ya go
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 16:17
I have a 90 minute drive home that I can now do in a happy little bubble .. thankyou. could use a couple points off stealers if you can please make that happen
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 16:18
Hahahaaaaa....man if I had any power to do that...we'd be playing a MUCH different game
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 16:19
I, for one, pledge my allegiance to JoeHammer
Price Van-Saint
@sk_Father_Price_twitter
Dec 05 2018 16:20
No! ... WarCrusher is the game of the future .. Joehammer is for mere plebians
cue Monty Python "Popular peoples front.." argument
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 16:24
SPLITTER!
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 17:08
....
Awwww y'all say the sweetest things
CrusherJoe @CrusherJoe blushes
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 17:09
WarCrusher...I dig it. JoeHammer also works
How many factions are there?
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 17:12
how ever many you want, bb :wink:
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 17:13
I was thinking every faction should get a month to be on top
Orktober is a given
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 17:13
ah, the Blizzard style of balance
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 17:14
GW MODIFIED How to Balance Your Game.png
I've gotten so much mileage out of the image
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 17:14
lol. that's the one
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 17:16
Great minds do indeed think alike :grinning:
Honestly
Fun-Sized is probably the right way
Remember the heady, halcyon days of the Indexes?
When everyone was pretty much even?
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Dec 05 2018 17:17
not fondly, because there were some armies that were out of balance even then
and the flavor was all sawdust and ash
Joe Beddoe
@CrusherJoe
Dec 05 2018 17:19
True
If there was any flavor to be had at all
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 17:23
yeah, most armies were pretty bland
i like the broken vs broken model. it works well for dota, as well as mtg, so i dont see why it cant work for 40k
tekton
@tekton
Dec 05 2018 17:31
@GenWilhelm did you previously put blizzard and balance in the same sentence? what madness is this?!
broken v broken works if all the types of broken have an even chance- it's why magic has actually homogenized more and more each set, but they've done it slowly that people haven't noticed as much
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 17:35
broken vs broken is also a main driver of power creep (except the sale of stuff, ofc).
Will Pattison
@GenWilhelm
Dec 05 2018 17:50
yeah, @tekton, i should have said """balance"""
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 17:55
well sc2 is pretty balanced, aint it?
tekton
@tekton
Dec 05 2018 19:38
Brood War and SC2 (except Heart) are very balanced that is true @Thairne
Really, Blizzard's teams are pretty good at finding balance in things- there were some rough patches once upon a time, but all of the games are pretty close really. I think some people miss that "team based" modes won't have exactly balanced group comps because it depends on the comp, which also means that each "class" isn't balanced 1v1 since the game itself isn't 1v1
WindstormSCR
@WindstormSCR
Dec 05 2018 21:07
Overwatch has some issues currently with newer heroes making some of the older ones exceptionally difficult to use as intended, a little bit of power creep there that they're trying to address
Simon Porter
@FarseerVeraenthis
Dec 05 2018 21:25
I'm very glad I've got some yellow spray, and some guardians, and some wraiths, and a wraithknight :smile:
(just to throw that in there)
Dirk Bachert
@Thairne
Dec 05 2018 21:26
for 300 pts :P