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    Schuyler Lindberg
    @schuyberg
    Hi all, I'm interested in contributing to the library-python-intro course, and was hoping someone could clarify whether the course is to be taught entirely in Anaconda/Spyder, or if it will use Jupyter Notebooks? The 'setup' section seems to suggest the former, but I see references in the lessons to Notebooks. Should these be removed? Cheers, S
    Belinda Weaver
    @weaverbel
    pinging @richyvk - you have a helper!
    Hey @schuyberg - welcome to the room !
    Schuyler Lindberg
    @schuyberg
    Thanks Belinda. It's been a busy summer for me, but I'm now (belatedly) attempting to finish my certification. I'm actually adapting parts of the python module for a guest lecture here at UBC and hoping to contribute something back in the process.
    Belinda Weaver
    @weaverbel
    Fantastic @schuyberg You can raise issues, comment on existing issues or review existing pull requests if you don't want to do a PR for something new against a lesson. All that counts as a contribution.
    @schuyberg The lesson owner for python-intro is @richyvk so you and he can have a bit of a chat at some stage
    Richard Vankoningsveld
    @richyvk

    @schuyberg Welcome Schuyler! Would be great to have some more contributions to the Python lesson. @c-martinez is a maintainer too. We have been slowly working through the lesson. I primary focus so far has been to make the content more library and less math. Since the Sprint earlier in the year we've slowed a bit on development, but I'm going to endeavor to ramp up again in a week or so.

    If you want to have a more in depth chat about it anytime please let me know. I can fill you in on a discussion I had a while back with @elliewix and @elainewong about its future direction.

    I'm hoping it might get some love via @chodacki 's grant too.

    To answer your question about Spyder or Jupyter, it was decided we would use Spyder, so yes, the setup needs fixing. If you want to do that and PR it that would be awesome :)

    Tim Dennis
    @jt14den
    @schuyberg welcome to gitter!
    @weaverbel I really like that job text for maintainer
    Juliane Schneider
    @JulianeS_twitter
    Agreed, good summary of the maintainer, @weaverbel!
    Schuyler Lindberg
    @schuyberg
    Sounds good @richyvk, I adapted some of the modules for a guest lecture/lesson that I taught this morning, and I did some work making the 'lists' module less "mathy" that I can clean up a little more and submit a PR for if you'd like. I also added a module on dictionaries - I know the submission docs say not to increase the scope, but I found it to be very useful for library students and they caught on fast as it is very applicable to the metadata schemas and structures that librarians use. I'd be happy to submit that as well if you're interested in the additional content.
    You can review the dictionaries module in my 'adapted' and abbreviated lesson here: https://schuyberg.github.io/library-python-api-intro/06-dictionaries/ Please let me know if you think it's worth submitting. My changes to lists and other modules are there as well, and I'll go back and merge the changes that are relevant back into my own fork of the official lesson before submitting a PR.
    Schuyler Lindberg
    @schuyberg
    (I was asked specifically to cover using the Open Collections API for this lesson, so I modified it to focus on the basics required to do that rather than follow the regular course plan)
    also, thanks @jt14den :)
    James Baker
    @drjwbaker
    @weaverbel Does LIS journals have 'associate editor' roles? The LIBER journal we published the LC article in doesn't. Instead it has an Editorial Board. Does anyone @/all edit a LIS journal?
    Belinda Weaver
    @weaverbel
    @drjwbaker The idea of the text is that people adapt it as they see fit to suit their circumstances. It isn't meant to be used as is but is there to help spark ideas/save time.
    Lesson maintainers for Library Carpentry are welcome to join the Carpentries maintainers mailing list - might be good to join discussions there? http://lists.software-carpentry.org/listinfo/maintainers
    Interesting post here from the recent call about it: https://software-carpentry.org/blog/2017/10/maintainer-follow-up.html
    James Baker
    @drjwbaker
    @weaverbel Okay. In that case, looks great :)
    Juliane Schneider
    @JulianeS_twitter
    Because I'm intrinsically obnoxious, I'm going to cross post this from the Lobby: Until lately I'd forgotten to sign up for the Maintainers super helpful listserv, I figured I'd post the link to sign up here. Maintainers, if you aren't on it, it really is full of useful discussion! http://lists.software-carpentry.org/listinfo/maintainers
    Belinda Weaver
    @weaverbel
    I am moving all the Library Carpentry lessons out of data-lessons and into the Library Carpentry organisation. I'll do a post once I've finished.
    Jez Cope
    @jezcope
    :thumbsup:
    Vicky Steeves
    @VickySteeves
    I am having trouble building the lesson sites locally. Do I need to run the jekyll site with the commands or jekyll, or use the Makefile?
    *commands for jekyll
    Mark Laufersweiler
    @laufers
    I have never actuall built a site using jekyll, I just previewed locally. What I do is in top directory hosting the code, I run “jekyll serve” and it starts the service and shows the local http address to open in your browser.
    Vicky Steeves
    @VickySteeves
    Thanks! That works.
    Tim Dennis
    @jt14den
    There’re instructions in contributing
    We have a convenience make file as well, make serve will work
    That make file does other stuff too, looks for some markdown errors
    Type make and you’ll get a list
    Juliane Schneider
    @JulianeS_twitter
    Does someone have the original file for the Open Refine lesson? doaj-article-sample? The one in the current lesson has many of the changes from the OR lesson already done
    for instance, all of the publishers are already in title caps
    Juliane Schneider
    @JulianeS_twitter
    Um....never mind.
    My bad.
    Belinda Weaver
    @weaverbel
    Hi all
    If you see a million emails about issues being closed, it is because I am copying them over to the Library Carpentry organisation on GitHub and closing them on data-lessons.
    Jez Cope
    @jezcope
    @weaverbel @richyvk @libcce moving the python discussion over here from lobby
    I'm pretty conflicted about Jupyter vs Spyder — they both have pros and cons
    Tim Dennis
    @jt14den
    @jezcope Jupyter is v good for novices, removes features that IDEs have but that lets learners focus on Python
    Also from an instructor POV swc and data carpentry use Jupyter, makes it easier for mixing and matching and instruction prep
    Jez Cope
    @jezcope
    @jt14den yup, i think all the other arguments are so equally balanced that "what swc and dc use" is what wins!
    for the record i completely agree with jupyter reducing cognitive load, and the counterargument for using spyder is that it introduces both the interactive console and scripts (which are the most common ways to use python for batch work) without the additional load of manipulating a separate commandline session and text editor
    i'm happy to have the debate if we need it, but i suspect it would just cover the same ground that swc & dc have already covered so we might as well take the short cut and use jupyter
    Tim Dennis
    @jt14den
    The cognitive load argument always wins for me pretty much, I’ve taught SWC juypter where we end up making a module via the built-in text editor, so it’s not like we are limited from covering how to make modules in jupyter
    Jez Cope
    @jezcope
    ooh, that's interesting. do you just export it to .py from jupyter? i hadn't really thought of that workflow but it makes complete sense, especially for learners
    Tim Dennis
    @jt14den
    As I recall we copied them to a file from jupyter b/c we had a long notebook with a bunch of stuff. Then we opened a new notebook, imported the module and ran the code from the new notebook. There’s a lesson somewhere - think it was ‘intermmediate python’. Your suggested approach would be cleaner, switch to a new notebook when you start functions, get them working and ouput to .py
    Jez Cope
    @jezcope
    i like that approach
    depending on how advanced your workshop was you could have a cell at the end with unit tests in that you keep returning to and running; probably not suitable for lc python intro though
    i'd be interested in thoughts about how we could get test-driven development in as a natural thing without too much cognitive load though
    Tim Dennis
    @jt14den
    I’ve never taught the unit testing stuff in SWC py, have never gotten there, would enjoy doing it