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    Falcon Jon
    @jonathan:falconprogrammer.co.uk
    [m]
    I can't make examples right now unfortunately, but thought I'd respond!
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]

    :point_up: Edit: So for context I run a weird little partnership of freelancers who run projects through the company. I have two initial questions:

    Question 1: Tracking project funds
    Each project is treated kind of like a fund -- which is to say each project has its own set of assets / funds associated with the project, ultimately managed by the project's owner. I'm treating these assets as sub-accounts of our primary bank account.

    So for instance:

    2017-09-01 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:GeneralOperating
    2018-03-18 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:ProjectA
    2018-12-10 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:ProjectB

    This is reasonable, but it does mean that I'm not able to track project resources until after a payment (e.g. I can't see what AccountsPayable / AccountsReceivable entries are associated with a project)

    The other issue is that some of our projects have money in a second, non-USD, bank account. This just means I would have to have mirrored sub-accounts for those projects.

    I looked into in using #tags to track project-based transactions but was blocked because sometimes a transaction might involve more than one project (e.g. a vendor might bill for more than one project in a single invoice) so I'm a bit stumped.

    Question 2: Tracking Accounts Payable / vendors)
    We also have vendors who help do some of the work who will invoice us. I want to be able to track how much we owe any given vendor, so I have created sub accounts of AccountsPayable. Also, at the end of the year I need to know how much I paid a given vendor for 1099-NECs, so I have sub-accounts of Expenses:

    2018-08-20 open Expenses:Wages:JaneDoe USD
    2018-08-20 open Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe USD

    And then an invoice might be:

    2018-08-20 * "Jane Doe " "invoice" ^2018-08-20-invoice-jdoe-1
     Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe           253.00 USD
     Expenses:Wages:JaneDoe

    and a payment might be

    2018-10-29 * "Jane Doe" "payment" ^2018-08-20-invoice-jdoe-1 #ProjectA
     Assets:Chase:Checking:ProjectA                   -253.00 USD
     Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe

    I'll pause there for now -- are sub accounts the best way to handle this? The downside of this approach is that I have a ton more accounts (e.g. every time I add a new vendor I have to explicitly open an account for them; every time I close the books for the year I have to zero out each expense account individually).

    Truly my goal is to be able to generate those two reports for the vendors (how much do I owe each vendor, and how much did I pay each vendor in a given fiscal period)

    We do have assets in multiple currencies; the tricky thing is that they are actually in separate accounts (as in literal bank accounts) which have separate statements / balances. I'm wary of breaking that account separation in the ledger just because I'd lose the ability to do things like balance checks on the capital accounts.
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]

    :point_up: Edit: So for context I run a weird little partnership of freelancers who run projects through the company. I have two initial questions:

    Question 1: Tracking project funds
    Each project is treated kind of like a fund -- which is to say each project has its own set of assets / funds associated with the project, ultimately managed by the project's owner. I'm treating these assets as sub-accounts of our primary bank account.

    So for instance:

    2017-09-01 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:GeneralOperating
    2018-03-18 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:ProjectA
    2018-12-10 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:ProjectB

    This is reasonable, but it does mean that I'm not able to track project resources until after a payment (e.g. I can't see what AccountsPayable / AccountsReceivable entries are associated with a project)

    The other issue is that some of our projects have money in a second, non-USD, bank account. This just means I would have to have mirrored sub-accounts for those projects.

    I looked into in using #tags to track project-based transactions but was blocked because sometimes a transaction might involve more than one project (e.g. a vendor might bill for more than one project in a single invoice) so I'm a bit stumped.

    Question 2: Tracking Accounts Payable / vendors)
    We also have vendors who help do some of the work who will invoice us. I want to be able to track how much we owe any given vendor, so I have created sub accounts of AccountsPayable. Also, at the end of the year I need to know how much I paid a given vendor for 1099-NECs, so I have sub-accounts of Expenses:

    2018-08-20 open Expenses:Wages:JaneDoe USD
    2018-08-20 open Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe USD

    And then an invoice might be:

    2018-08-20 * "Jane Doe " "invoice" ^2018-08-20-invoice-jdoe-1
     Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe           253.00 USD
     Expenses:Wages:JaneDoe

    and a payment might be

    2018-10-29 * "Jane Doe" "payment" ^2018-08-20-invoice-jdoe-1
     Assets:Chase:Checking:ProjectA                   -253.00 USD
     Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe

    I'll pause there for now -- are sub accounts the best way to handle this? The downside of this approach is that I have a ton more accounts (e.g. every time I add a new vendor I have to explicitly open an account for them; every time I close the books for the year I have to zero out each expense account individually).

    Truly my goal is to be able to generate those two reports for the vendors (how much do I owe each vendor, and how much did I pay each vendor in a given fiscal period)

    :point_up: Edit: So for context I run a weird little partnership of freelancers who run projects through the company. I have two initial questions:

    Question 1: Tracking project funds
    Each project is treated kind of like a fund -- which is to say each project has its own set of assets / funds associated with the project, ultimately managed by the project's owner. I'm treating these assets as sub-accounts of our primary bank account.

    So for instance:

    2017-09-01 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:GeneralOperating
    2018-03-18 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:ProjectA
    2018-12-10 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:ProjectB

    This is reasonable, but it does mean that I'm not able to track project resources until after a payment (e.g. I can't see what AccountsPayable / AccountsReceivable entries are associated with a project)

    The other issue is that some of our projects have money in a second, non-USD, bank account. This just means I would have to have mirrored sub-accounts for those projects.

    I looked into in using #tags to track project-based transactions but was blocked because sometimes a transaction might involve more than one project (e.g. a vendor might bill for more than one project in a single invoice) so I'm a bit stumped.

    Question 2: Tracking Accounts Payable / vendors)
    We also have vendors who help do some of the work who will invoice us. I want to be able to track how much we owe any given vendor, so I have created sub accounts of AccountsPayable. Also, at the end of the year I need to know how much I paid a given vendor for 1099-NECs, so I have sub-accounts of Expenses:

    2018-08-20 open Expenses:Wages:JaneDoe USD
    2018-08-20 open Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe USD

    And then an invoice might be:

    2018-08-20 * "Jane Doe " "invoice" ^2018-08-20-invoice-jdoe-1
     Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe           -253.00 USD
     Expenses:Wages:JaneDoe

    and a payment might be

    2018-10-29 * "Jane Doe" "payment" ^2018-08-20-invoice-jdoe-1
     Assets:Chase:Checking:ProjectA                   -253.00 USD
     Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe

    I'll pause there for now -- are sub accounts the best way to handle this? The downside of this approach is that I have a ton more accounts (e.g. every time I add a new vendor I have to explicitly open an account for them; every time I close the books for the year I have to zero out each expense account individually).

    Truly my goal is to be able to generate those two reports for the vendors (how much do I owe each vendor, and how much did I pay each vendor in a given fiscal period)

    :point_up: Edit: So for context I run a weird little partnership of freelancers who run projects through the company. I have two initial questions:

    Question 1: Tracking project funds
    Each project is treated kind of like a fund -- which is to say each project has its own set of assets / funds associated with the project, ultimately managed by the project's owner. I'm treating these assets as sub-accounts of our primary bank account.

    So for instance:

    2017-09-01 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:GeneralOperating
    2018-03-18 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:ProjectA
    2018-12-10 open Assets:MyBank:Checking:ProjectB

    This is reasonable, but it does mean that I'm not able to track project resources until after a payment (e.g. I can't see what AccountsPayable / AccountsReceivable entries are associated with a project)

    The other issue is that some of our projects have money in a second, non-USD, bank account. This just means I would have to have mirrored sub-accounts for those projects.

    I looked into in using #tags to track project-based transactions but was blocked because sometimes a transaction might involve more than one project (e.g. a vendor might bill for more than one project in a single invoice) so I'm a bit stumped.

    Question 2: Tracking Accounts Payable / vendors
    We also have vendors who help do some of the work who will invoice us. I want to be able to track how much we owe any given vendor, so I have created sub accounts of AccountsPayable. Also, at the end of the year I need to know how much I paid a given vendor for 1099-NECs, so I have sub-accounts of Expenses:

    2018-08-20 open Expenses:Wages:JaneDoe USD
    2018-08-20 open Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe USD

    And then an invoice might be:

    2018-08-20 * "Jane Doe " "invoice" ^2018-08-20-invoice-jdoe-1
     Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe           -253.00 USD
     Expenses:Wages:JaneDoe

    and a payment might be

    2018-10-29 * "Jane Doe" "payment" ^2018-08-20-invoice-jdoe-1
     Assets:Chase:Checking:ProjectA                   -253.00 USD
     Liabilities:AccountsPayable:JaneDoe

    I'll pause there for now -- are sub accounts the best way to handle this? The downside of this approach is that I have a ton more accounts (e.g. every time I add a new vendor I have to explicitly open an account for them; every time I close the books for the year I have to zero out each expense account individually).

    Truly my goal is to be able to generate those two reports for the vendors (how much do I owe each vendor, and how much did I pay each vendor in a given fiscal period)

    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    slifty: re question 1, why not put the project names at level 2
    1 reply
    Assets:ProjectA:MyBank:... etc.
    (I would put them at level 1, but I think beancount won't allow it)
    can't you run a report including MyBank:Checking across all projects ?
    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    or equivalently, you can keep your current structure and report on ProjectA across all Assets, Liabilities etc.
    this is easy in h/ledger and beancount must have a way too
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]

    I should probably learn what running a report is 😅

    I think your second suggestion (running the report on the internal abstraction / on the project, rather than the external structure / the account) would be easier to swing simply because when I'm ingesting data from my bank account (e.g. for the example vendor payment above) the account the statement / data is related to is Assets:MyBank:Checking, not broken down by project.

    (ty by the way, I'll check this out!)

    Would metadata be a reasonable solution to this? E.g. being able to tag transaction legs with project: MyProjectA or whatever (I can't tell if this would get super tedious, or if this is simply the intention of metadata... I truly truly wish I could use #tags since it seems the fava interface treats tags as a first class piece of metadata in its UX)
    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    yes tags can be useful when you have crosscutting account hierarchies like this, but they are often used unnecessarily. Here you can simply match on the existing account name
    1 reply
    "ProjectA"
    (when I say "running a report", that means running some command in the terminal to see just the numbers I want - most of us non-fava users do this. I'm not sure how you use beancount/fava)
    1 reply
    when tracking finances for multiple entities in a single file, it's important to keep things clear of course. Wouldn't you want to divide up income/expenses by project as well ?
    I assume so too, but I'm really confused about beancount's CLI, sorry
    gary
    @garyp:matrix.org
    [m]
    slifty: for question 1, I would probably add the project as metadata on the individual posting rather than sub-accounts for each project. I think you should then be able to write a beancount query using the metadata in order to get a balance for just a specific project even across multiple bank accounts. And you can put the metadata on your Accounts Payable/Receivable postings too.
    slifty: for question 2, why do you need the separate sub-account for each vendor? I would just put them all in one account and do a report by payee to see each vendor's balance.
    1 reply
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]

    @gary I am storing invoices alongside my ledger; do you know if it's possible to maintain a document structure that doesn't mirror accounts directly (e.g. if I track vendor using the Payee model)? With sub-accounts I had each invoice in a ./Liabilities/AccountsPayable/VendorNameHere which aligned with the account. Fava seemed opinionated about that file structure, but I'm wondering if maybe I'm not so locked in.

    (or, alternatively maybe I keep the AP sub-accounts but ditch the expense sub-accounts. food for thought.)

    I know I'm saying thanks a lot but why stop now: thank you so much for the advice

    simonmic:matrix.org @simonmic:matrix.org would stick with accounts for such an important subdivision that needs to be reliable
    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    but, YMMV! whatever works
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]

    sm: ah! Are you talking about for vendors or the project concept (or both)?

    Now that you mention that, I do think the reason I was worried about relying on Payee was the potential for typos -- whereas with accounts I'd get an error if I screw it up

    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    right. I was responding to "why do you need the separate sub-account for each vendor"
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]
    sm: Got it -- point well taken; and to that end where I might wind up is "sub accounts for AP" (which addresses my document problem too), but NO sub-accounts for the expense.
    Once this is all done maybe I'll write a blog post to share what I've learned in case it helps others in future...
    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    when you find you need to report things separately, that's the time to add separate accounts for them, usually
    until then, less is more!
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]
    sm: I like that rule of thumb
    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    the fewer moving parts, the better. Finances get complex enough already
    that's my motto
    my PTA survival tip :)
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]
    Nuts, wish Fava could let me visualize by payee -- that's one big downside to not using vendor sub-accounts (e.g. being able to have my TreeMap show me which vendor is being paid the most, rather than one big Wages block)
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]
    Update: oh yay beancount/fava#756
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]
    I see fava has "fava.plugins.link_documents" as a listed plugin, but the documentation doesn't make it too clear if this is enabled by default or if I have to do something to make it work... Anybody here know how I can have documents appear as linked to my transactions?
    slifty
    @slifty:matrix.org
    [m]
    Looks like I just have to type plugin "fava.plugins.link_documents" in my ledger (btw what is the "noun" for a beancount document? is it ledger? recordset?)
    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    journal I usually call it, from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_journal
    Rudde
    @Rudde
    Are there no offical fava docker?
    Vlad Rafeev
    @dandaka
    Hey everyone! Is it possible to get an account statement? I am looking for a basic report, that will include
    — opening balance
    — closing balance
    — all transactions between
    3 replies
    one-validr
    @one-validr
    Hello, how to bind fava to https?
    I think I shall put fava under a reverse proxy.
    Other suggestion?
    yusf
    @yusf:gottsnack.net
    [m]
    @one-validr: there are various implementations on Docker Hub 🙂
    one-validr
    @one-validr
    Ok, i'll check ;)
    simonmic:matrix.org @simonmic:matrix.org would try caddy
    sm
    @simonmic:matrix.org
    [m]
    how would you convert to cost or value with Beancount, like Ledger's -B or -V/-X ?
    Alan Hawrylyshen
    @muonzoo
    Inventories are held at cost. You can write a query that uses your price data to show value.
    I'm pretty sure there's and example query in the docs and if not check the pta wiki?
    If not I can dig up an example of you ping the thread again and I'm on my laptop