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An Long
@aisk
Cool!
An Long
@aisk
Dose the optimized codes will be working on the stuff which pep523 described, thus it can be support by CPython "officially" and the user can using it without any capalibility corcerns?
Kevin Modzelewski
@kmod
We use Cython, which is a different way of achieving CPython support
There are some small compatibility differences but for the most part it's just drop-in :)
An Long
@aisk
Just have a little experience on cython, but looks like cython can not aot compile the whole standard library (or runtime). So if the new project is based on cython, does it have the ability to optimize the runtime?
Kevin Modzelewski
@kmod
Oh interesting! Do you have any more info on this?
I've only seen https://cython.readthedocs.io/en/latest/src/userguide/limitations.html which makes their compatibility seem quite good
Also I'd say we "use" cython and are not "based on" cython -- we use cython to lower Python code to C code, and then do a number of C-level tricks to optimize the generated code
I'm not sure which "runtime" you're referring to, but we definitely optimize the CPython C runtime :)
Also if anyone is interested, I started putting up some issues on our issue tracker. They should be pretty approachable and would be helpful!
Sun
@Daetalus
I modified Cython source code for support new syntax, which is add a type called "nogil extension" to get rid of Cython environment, so we can enable multicore support for Python-like syntax. https://lab.nexedi.com/Daetalus/cython/commits/nogil_extension_lwan
Sun
@Daetalus
It is a personal/community project, right?
Kevin Modzelewski
@kmod
Cool!
You mean nitrous (previously called dpro)? Yep a community project :)
If have a file:
import pyximport
pyximport.install(pyimport=True, build_dir='xx')

import six
Since six is a pure python module, looks like cython can cythonize it totally, but I got an error while run this file:
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "a.py", line 4, in <module>
    import six
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 419, in load_module
    return load_module(fullname, source_path, so_path=so_path, is_package=is_package)
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 233, in load_module
    exec("raise exc, None, tb", {'exc': exc, 'tb': tb})
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 216, in load_module
    mod = imp.load_dynamic(name, so_path)
  File "six.py", line 805, in init six
    _add_doc(reraise, """Reraise an exception.""")
ImportError: Building module six failed: ["NameError: name 'reraise' is not defined\n"]
An Long
@aisk
A quick dig is that reraise is defined with exec statement with reraise function as a string, so seems cython don't support this use case.
Another try is just change the import six to import requests, with another error:
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "a.py", line 4, in <module>
    import requests
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 419, in load_module
    return load_module(fullname, source_path, so_path=so_path, is_package=is_package)
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 233, in load_module
    exec("raise exc, None, tb", {'exc': exc, 'tb': tb})
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 216, in load_module
    mod = imp.load_dynamic(name, so_path)
  File "__init__.py", line 43, in init requests.__init__
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 419, in load_module
    return load_module(fullname, source_path, so_path=so_path, is_package=is_package)
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 233, in load_module
    exec("raise exc, None, tb", {'exc': exc, 'tb': tb})
  File "/Users/anlong/Library/Python/2.7/lib/python/site-packages/pyximport/pyximport.py", line 216, in load_module
    mod = imp.load_dynamic(name, so_path)
  File "__init__.py", line 8, in init urllib3.__init__
ImportError: Building module requests failed: ["ImportError: Building module urllib3 failed: ['ValueError: Attempted relative import in non-package\\n']\n"]
An Long
@aisk
Another try is with flask and jedi, and they all failed.
An Long
@aisk
Looks like cython have more limitations than the documents said. Improve the compatibility of cython is good, but I don't know how long the gaps were.
Kevin Modzelewski
@kmod
Interesting! A bit disappointing, but good to know
An Long
@aisk
FYI, another cython like tools is nuitka, and looks like it can compile more modules to binary.
Pratyush Das
@reikdas
Might be interesting to read, Guido Van Rossum was rather harsh about nuitka - https://www.pycon.it/conference/talks/nuitka-the-python-compiler
Yair Ivan Medina Cota
@yairi.medinac_gitlab
hello
Joobi
@joobi10_twitter
hi
is this the place where I can have questions about dropbox API ?
Kevin Modzelewski
@kmod
Hey all, I wrote up a blog post giving some motivation for the new direction we're thinking of taking for Pyston v2, check it out!
Pratyush Das
@reikdas
@kmod What happened to dpro?
Kevin Modzelewski
@kmod
It got renamed to nitrous :)
btw there's a HN conversation going on: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23235930
Dong-hee Na
@corona10
Wow
Suminda Sirinath Salpitikorala Dharmasena
@sirinath
Any new developments in the reboot?
Kevin Modzelewski
@kmod
We're hoping to do our first release next week!
Key word is "hope", it's been a week away for a little bit now :)
Marius Wachtler
@undingen
Hi folks, sorry for not logging into gitter for a very long time :/.

https://developers.redhat.com/blog/2020/01/20/mir-a-lightweight-jit-compiler-project/

I did notice that project too. Sounds interesting. Currently it says: This code is in initial stages of development. It is present only for familiarization with the project.
Looking forward to see what they come up with. Having an optimizing JIT which is faster than LLVM would be very nice :)

Kevin Modzelewski
@kmod
Hi all, we just relaunched Pyston, check out our blog post: https://blog.pyston.org/2020/10/28/pyston-v2-20-faster-python/
We decided to move the chat to discord, so please follow us there at https://discord.gg/S7gsqnb