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promovicz
@promovicz
with regards to macros I'm still thinking. I'm tending towards wanting a macro expander implemented in dylan because we already have that code. the parsers of the interpreters would have to emit a (possibly shared) d-expr representation.
that way the code could be borrowed from dfmc, dbmc or d2c. they all kind of do this already. the dfmc version probably has the code with the best factoring.
it also has the best features (template calls).
Jon Godbout
@Slids
How do I get format statements to print before dylan finishes?
Carl Gay
@cgay
force-out() and/or force-err()
I would like these to happen by default, but I think maybe that's expensive? Maybe we could set them up to happen by default (line buffered?) but have a way to turn them off for performance. I think we discussed this at one point...I'll check history.
Carl Gay
@cgay
Only this :point_up: March 21, 2019 12:42 PM
Is the new Dune movie any good? Should I use my $10 Google Fi credit on it?
Peter S. Housel
@housel
I have line buffering half-implemented in a stash someplace
(Of course some of my stashes are named things like with-many-snerk and moths-and-butterflies so I may or may not be able to find it)
Jon Godbout
@Slids
the new dune movie is only part 1 of n
Not defaulting to outputting the values hurts the printf(format-out) debugging I always do... Any chance of a repl? :)
Peter S. Housel
@housel
Soon
(Hopefully by mid-Spring)
promovicz
@promovicz
@cgay stdio in libc makes stderr unbuffered. that's how they deal with it. they also flush atexit IIRC.
a working repl in opendylan might be a magnet for me. :)
Carl Gay
@cgay
format-outf == format-out(...) + force-out() :smirk:
Only 1/2 joking. I've been using a debug-out that is basically that.
Carl Gay
@cgay
Flushing at exit would solve the biggest part of the problem. It's one thing to not see the output right away and it's another thing altogether to never see it at all.
Peter S. Housel
@housel
Everything does get flushed at exit
(unhandled exception aborts possibly excepted)
Carl Gay
@cgay
hmm, I could swear I've seen that not happen. yeah, maybe due to errors.
Carl Gay
@cgay
I just noticed that showing macro expansion fragments (or whatever the right term for ?"expr1" is) shows the associativity of infix operators. At least I think that's what's going on when testworks turns my 5 * 60 * 60 into: ((5 * 60) * 60) = zone-offset-seconds(us-eastern, time:, t1) failed [18000 and -18000 are not =.]
Carl Gay
@cgay
I thought if I have /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libzip.so.4.0 and I put c-libraries: -lzip in my LID file I should be able to link against this, but I'm getting Internal error: Link failed: Link failed: /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lzip.
Ah, it fails for the zlib library as well, so I guess there is probably something misconfigured on my system.
Carl Gay
@cgay
Linking libzip.so to libzip.so.4.0 works, but sadly I have no idea why I should be required to do that.
Peter S. Housel
@housel
You don’t have libzip-dev installed
You should be able to run pkg-config --libs libzip and get the right link invocation
Carl Gay
@cgay
ok, thanks. But I guess my bigger problem is that I don't understand the general philosophy. Or maybe that's too grandiose of a word; I don't understand why, if simply creating a link is enough, they don't just do it for all installed libraries in advance...
It helps to read the overview for pkg-config (which was apparently written by a guy named Havoc). I'll try to remember that's what I need in cases like this.
Peter S. Housel
@housel
Particular programs are set to runtime-link against libzip.so.4.0, but the linker doesn’t search through all the possible .n.m versions in its link path
The dev package provides the symlink .so that the linker will find
But if you’re just running programs that need libzip but not developing against it then you don’t need that
Carl Gay
@cgay
So at link time presumably the linker resolves the symlink and embeds the specific version in the executable?
Or more likely it has nothing to do with the file name but is embedded in the .so itself, I suppose.
promovicz
@promovicz
Making small strides in marlais... the code is now warning-free and I'm starting to work on the interpreter core.
It is also pretty namespace-clean now. I'm currently working to collect the interpreter state into a context structure, among other things.
its definitely fun to do this with interaction. it feels natural to dylan.
It seems to me that marlais can be "compatible without macros" in a few more months.
My goal definitely is library reuse.
promovicz
@promovicz
Macros are important to some libraries but not to others. I haven't estimated yet how much work real macro support would take...
I still prefer marlais over mindy because it is so much simpler. It's the ideal testbed.
Carl Gay
@cgay
Sounds like good progress.
I'm working on getting rid of shelling out to git in pacman and download via HTTP instead. Hence the work on libzip.
promovicz
@promovicz
I'm definitely having fun. Been thinking about how to turn all of this into a useful project too. Bruce does have a point after all. It's good to have a driving goal for a project like this, and some success generally doesn't hurt either.
@cgay important work IMO. ecosystem-wide I believe that library packaging and the organization of the library ecosystem are really important.
Carl Gay
@cgay
I probably said this before, but without macros (i.e., being a full Dylan implementation) I probably wouldn't use Marlais or Mindy. If it did have macros I could definitely see using it though.
promovicz
@promovicz
Yeah, that's one of the reasons why I consider this a bit experimental.
OD with interaction should also cover many use cases for a fixed up marlais. not all though.