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    f00bar
    @f00bar
    so now it looks like the new RPC changes that you make will defunc my JS light client since it relies on eth_accounts, eth_sendTransaction and eth_sign, etc...
    : ((
    shouldn't developer have the choice of choosing the choreography that best suits their needs? i.e fully decentralize and more of a client/server architecture
    Péter Szilágyi
    @karalabe
    Those won't be removed any time soon, that'a long term question
    Though I can't promise anything on that front, it's not really my decision
    I personally would probably leave it in as legacy support, even if we "encourage" outside account handlig
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    like I wouldn't even attempt to build whatever I'm building right now if I have to ask every single user of my service to download, install, configure and run a geth node
    : ))
    if you don't allow external transaction signers, this will greatly limit the appeal of using ethereum in my opinion
    Fabian Vogelsteller
    @frozeman
    The idea is to the key signing out to an external service or the dapp itself.
    As @karalabe says it will be there for the foreseeable future.
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    @frozeman what would that 'external service' look like ?
    Fabian Vogelsteller
    @frozeman
    If you do keysigning in your dapp you would use eth_sendRawTransaction
    A commandline tool for signing
    Or something. Or e. G. Mist
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    will I be able to use eth_sendRawTransaction from web3.js in the future ?
    Fabian Vogelsteller
    @frozeman
    @karalabe mist doesn't not do key signing right now. It just intercepts send requests and only delay them after unlock
    @f00bar yes
    We might rename it ;)
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    so I'm looking at ethereum not as the platform for dapps. I'm looking at ethereum as a blockchain platform that could be tied up with light web clients (key pairs are managed clientside)
    I don't think most of my users will know that there's ethereum networking running in the background
    so yes it is a client/server model but that's ok with me and the service I'm trying to build
    I don't believe stand alone dapps and browsers will really gain popularity outside of the blockchain enthusiasts anyhow
    but everyone is entitled to an opinion ...
    Fabian Vogelsteller
    @frozeman
    Sure you can do and we won't remove any support for that. Actually we move in a similar direction. Expect with a light client.
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    @frozeman the 'new' light client that you guys are building out - would that be running as an actual process?
    Fabian Vogelsteller
    @frozeman
    Though web3 might only Support websockets for your purpose in the future. As we introduce pub/sub
    Yes
    You can do your remote service now already
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    so that's not really a light client (in my understanding)
    Fabian Vogelsteller
    @frozeman
    Yours not yes.
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    so how would I integrate my iphone app with the new light client - I will be able to use libraries or my iOS app will have to run an additional process on my iphone ?
    Fabian Vogelsteller
    @frozeman
    That's still to be figured out. @karalabe can help here better
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    would Apple even allow that ?
    Felix Lange
    @fjl
    @f00bar we're working towards a library that you can link
    if you're interested in helping us define a good API for that, please shout
    Péter Szilágyi
    @karalabe
    First version will however only launch a geth instance, per the CLI specs
    and provide the same RPC/IPC interfaces
    that a current isntance allow
    s
    Felix Lange
    @fjl
    what you can get right now (more or less) is a static C library that gives you one function: startGeth ;)
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    I really don't understand why there isn't a separation of concerns (i.e clients that are interested in writing and reading from the blockchain and clients that are interested in mining/validating
    Felix Lange
    @fjl
    How would that help?
    I mean, you don't have to mine if you don't want to ;)
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    I'm just coming from a different perspective and I think people are getting lost in the 'decentralization for decentralization's sake wagon
    Felix Lange
    @fjl
    In order to reliably read from the blockchain, you need to be able to validate block headers, the state, etc.
    In order to execute contract calls, you need to have the EVM.
    f00bar
    @f00bar
    yeah and I will have backend servers that are running geth nodes
    and they will be doing that on behalf of my light web clients
    Felix Lange
    @fjl
    right
    that's great for your web clients, then.