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  • Jun 13 08:02
    @jaspervdm banned @matrixbot
  • May 06 2018 21:29
    User @ignopeverell unbanned @maesitos
  • May 06 2018 00:41
    @ignopeverell banned @maesitos
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
@lehnberg We are a small and tight team of developers and did not want any distractions while we were laying out the foundations. The code will be open soon and we will welcome reviewers and contributors.
hashmap
@hashmap
I like Beam and it’s not because I’m a Russian:) It doesn’t look like a scam, but solid technical work and it’s good to have more than one impl of MW. Their main forte is a company behind the project which means funding which means resources to develop quickly. It’s also the main weakness because it can’t grow into a real open source project (like linux for example) which attracts many developers. And corporate politics of course.
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
@BigRomanov Just noticed that there was a typo here. The correct link for any questions for me and our team is: https://t.me/beamprivacy
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
Pre-allocated mining rewards != premise ??? Please share the logic here.
*premine
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
We do not have premine, but rather a treasury, similar to ZCash.
John Tromp
@tromp
@bladedoyle you can edit in-place. click on ... on right
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
I have to go for today, but before that just wanted to say that we are great fans of Grin and respect both the project and the team immensely.
lehnberg
@lehnberg
Thanks for taking the time to answer questions @BigRomanov! Good luck with the project ✌️
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
I don't see edit in place on mobile
Ignotus Peverell
@ignopeverell
I vehemently deny all allegations of being made of one or multiple robots
Yeastplume
@yeastplume
only a mecha-robot denies allegations like that
Ignotus Peverell
@ignopeverell
ok fine, I was a big fan of Grendizer at some point
Yeastplume
@yeastplume
QED
Ignotus Peverell
@ignopeverell
however, I find the idea of a Canadian-Irish person drinking Vodka highly dubious
so definitely can understand why people don't believe in @yeastplume at all
Yeastplume
@yeastplume
I'm just a story parents like to scare their children with
umma08
@umma08

they’re not to first other project to implent MW and won’t be the last. all we can do is stick to our principles to try to ensure Grin is developed and governed for the benefit of all of its users rather than a small group of people. I think that alone is one of our biggest distinguishing features

having been away for a few days, i have returned to read a chat between @BigRomanov and @tromp that, i have to say, seemed like it was from another planet.

what @yeastplume said above on the matter makes me happy to be here as apposed to anywhere else, and should give us all a warm fuzzy feeling inside :-)

@ignopeverell Irish people will drink anything really. this is coming from an Irish person
Ignotus Peverell
@ignopeverell
@umma08 heh heh, point taken
I think @tromp was being delightfully facetious
umma08
@umma08
@ignopeverell couldnt tell. i didnt understand any of it
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
I pushed the current (incomplete) state of the grin-pool project: https://github.com/grin-pool/grin-pool
Participation is welcome, criticism is also but I prefer if it comes with a pull request ;)
jaspervdm
@jaspervdm
nice
Tom Charovski
@MohitoGrande_gitlab
@BigRomanov Hi!
How scheme with treasure will work in MW? For every transaction (including coinbase) interaction between all parties is required. Is treasure model implies that developer wallet should always be online for correct block generation?
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
@MohitoGrande_gitlab Hi, Tom. Since it would be impractical for each miner to connect to the Treasury wallet for every block, we have done something different. Since the exact amount of treasury coins is known for each block, just like the mining reward, we pre generate all treasury UTXOs in the Genesis block (or blocks, since we support multiple Genesis blocks to keep block size the same as the regular block). Each such UTXO, however, has a maturity parameter aligned with the block it should be allocated in. This is what makes it different from premine. For example, if at block N, a 100 coins were created, 80 of them go to the miner, and the 20 stored in the Treasury and have maturity N become available for spending.
John Tromp
@tromp
what's the UTXO set size at genesis then?
@BigRomanov
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
It depends, in general, on how often the treasury utxos are distributed, daily, monthly, quarterly etc...
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
@BigRomanov So you have pre allocated 20% for 5 years, and pre generate the UTXO in the genesis block, but claim this is not a pre-mine?
John Tromp
@tromp
it's a timelocked premine
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
You can put whatver word you want in front but its still a premine
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
As far as I understand in premine the coins are available immediately at launch.
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
semantics
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
For us this is just a technical solution that is simpler than constant wallet communication
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
Im not a big fan of pre-mine coins or ICO
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
Is ZCash considered premined? Just so I am clear in terminology.
John Tromp
@tromp
no, it's called a mining tax
yours is a monthly (weekly?) mining tax implemented as a timelocked premine
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
We call it the "Treasury"
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
In a down market, Monero market cap is $2,210,992,983 so 20% = 422M. Is that a reasonable tax?
Anyway, Im not the one you need to convince
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
We hope to be bigger than Monero. Also, most of the Treasury goes to our investors and a Non Profit Foundation that will maintain and develop Beam in the future.
Blade Doyle
@bladedoyle
Based on the top 10 market cap cryptos right now, premine / ico / treasury tax does not seem to matter much. I guess you do need to worry about somebody forking away from your tax but maybe the quality of your development team can deter the community from following the fork.
Your "C++ maturity" argument is compelling.
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
We are developing a whole solution. Our roadmap includes all types of wallets, integration with HW wallets, Atomic Swap based exchange from within the wallet to allow easy onboarding and other usability enhancement features. We really want Beam to be as easy to use as possible.
François
@mably
@BigRomanov have you anything planned on the layer 2 side? state channels, etc?
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
We are currently focusing on implementing layer one as best as we can. We believe that the main use case is confidential store of value. Layer 2 isn't a priority for us at the moment.
Alex Romanov
@BigRomanov
Confidential assets issuance is also very interesting use case we intend to develop.
François
@mably
Is it easily feasible over MW?