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    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt
    This idea needs some work to be consistent, but it would be nice if there were some helper method that let you move an "inner" error to an "outer" one more easily.
    For example (value: EitherT[Future, A :+: B :+: CNil, Result]).ignore(identity[B]) results in an EitherT[Future, A, Result] given B is a Throwable.
    This could maybe use a MonadError[Future, Throwable].
    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt
    That would be a lot more ergonomic than value.handleSomeWith((e: B) => EitherT(Future.failed(e))
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang
    that should be easy enough to do
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang
    Can't really use MonadError though because it completely hides the error type (It deals with F[A])
    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt
    Could we do liike
    type TheMonadErrorWeNeed[F[_, _], R, E] = MonadError[F[*, R], E]
    def ignore[L1, L1Out, E](funct: L1 => E)(implicit monadError: TheMonadErrorWeNeed[F, R, E], ...)
    in ErrorTransCoproductOps?
    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt
    Or I suppose we could just make our own thing like
    trait Raisable[F[_, _], E] {
      def raise[L, R](f: F[L, R])(e: => E): F[L, R]
    }
    object Raisable {
      implicit def eitherTRaisable[F[_], E](implicit monadError: MonadError[F, E]) = new Raisable[EitherT[F, _, _], E] {
        def raise[L, R](f: EitherT[F, L, R])(e: => E): EitherT[F, L, R] = f.flatMapF(_ => monadError.raiseError(e))
      }
    }
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang

    I'm defining something like

    trait ErrorTransThrow[F[_, _]] extends ErrorTrans[F] {
      def raiseError[L, E, R, LL](in: F[L, R]): F[LL, R]
    }

    I don't think user will want to create an implicit TheMonadErrorWeNeed for every error(s) they want to throw

    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt
    I don't really understand the ErrorTransThrow. Should raiseError have a second parameter list?
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang
    yes it would (need some sort of elimination function). Still working on it :)
    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt
    @jatcwang
    Nice, that syntax looks very concise. But what if the LHS error isn't a throwable? It might be more generally useful to let ErrorTransThrow work for any E and/or have dieIf take a parameter L1 => E.
    also, would it work to use scala.DummyImplicit instead of DummyParam?
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang

    @kag0 nice Didn't know about DummyImplicit :D

    I'm wondering what are you going to do with the errors you specified if it's not a throwable? (I don't really want to encourage people do silently ignore errors..)

    If you want to transform particular errors into the other type, you can use handleError to handle a subset of the errors and turn them into some other error type? (The result type should be correctly inferred)

    Note that I'm thinking of changing the names from handle1, handleSome to mapError1 and mapSomeError

    (following ZIO naming convention which I think makes a lot of sense)
    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt

    so that would look like

    thing
      .mapSomeError((e: MyError) => new MyOtherError(e))
      .dieIf[MyOtherError]

    ?

    That makes sense. Users can always make their own syntax if they want to shorten that up.
    As far as non-throwable errors, I'm just thinking of edge cases where maybe the error type is a subtype of Throwable, or maybe the user is possesed to have an Either[FatalE, Either[ExpectedE, Result]] or something.
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang
    yeah that'll work. We can provide a mapSomeAndDie but it's probably to keep the API surface small for now.
    Not too sure what you mean in the latter paragraph. I'm guessing you mean that the user wants to go from F[FatalE :+: Expected E :+: CNil, Result] to F[FatalE :+: CNil, F[ExpectedE, Result]? You can use flatmapError for that (it's currently named handleSomeWith)
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang
    Pushed my changes and tagged it 0.0.5
    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt

    A concrete example might be like

    val before: Either[FatalE, Either[ExpectedE :+: FatalE :+: CNil, Result]] = ???
    val after: Either[FatalE, Either[ExpectedE :+: CNil, Result]] = ???

    so you're suggesting that a user could do

    val after = before.flatMap(_.flatmapError((e: ExpectedE) => Right(Left(e))))

    ?

    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt

    I was thinking the same could be done like

    val after = EitherT(before).dieIf[FatalE]

    you'd just need to remove the type constraint on E in ErrorTransThrow.extractAndThrow

    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang
    I guess I've never seen a signature like that, as you'd normally use flatMap and avoid it altogether (especially with the for comprehension support my library provides)
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang
    (So to generalize, you want F[E1, F[E1 :+: E2 :+: CNil]] => F[E1 :+: E2 :+: CNil, F[E2 :+: CNil, R]]?
    this is quite different from "dying", where you actually "blackholes" certain errors because they are thrown, terminating the whole chain. I cannot remove the Throwable constraint since ZIO instance requires it.
    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt

    (So to generalize, you want F[E1, F[E1 :+: E2 :+: CNil]] => F[E1 :+: E2 :+: CNil, F[E2 :+: CNil, R]]?

    errm, more like F[E1, F[E1 :+: E2 :+: CNil]] => F[E1, F[E2 :+: CNil, R]]. the example might be getting a bit convoluted/confusing.

    really I'm just suggesting the typeclass look like
    trait ErrorTransThrow[F[_, _], E] extends ErrorTrans[F] {
      def extractAndThrow[L, R, LL](in: F[L, R])(extractUnhandled: L => Either[E, LL]): F[LL, R]
    }
    then ZIO can be supported with
    implicit def zioErrorTrans[Env] =
      new ErrorTransThrow[ZIO[Env, *, *], Throwable] {
    
        override def extractAndThrow[L, R, LL](in: ZIO[Env, L, R])(
          extractUnhandled: L => Either[Throwable, LL],
        ): ZIO[Env, LL, R] = in.catchAll { errors =>
          extractUnhandled(errors) match {
            case Left(throwable) => ZIO.die(throwable)
            case Right(handledErrors) => ZIO.fail(handledErrors)
          }
        }
      }
    and eithert can be
    implicit def eitherTErrorTrans[G[_], E](implicit gMonadError: MonadError[G, E]): ErrorTransThrow[EitherT[G, *, *], E] =
      new ErrorTransThrow[EitherT[G, *, *], E] {
    
        override def extractAndThrow[L, R, LL](in: EitherT[G, L, R])(
          extractUnhandled: L => Either[E, LL]
        ) = in.leftFlatMap { l =>
          extractUnhandled(l) match {
            case Left(e) => EitherT(gMonadError.raiseError(e))
            case Right(ll) => pureError(ll)
          }
        }
      }
    Nathaniel Fischer
    @nrktkt
    then my convoluted example should work fine
    Jacob Wang
    @jatcwang

    I think there's a generalization hidden in those examples somewhere. It feels like some sort of leftFlatten (Although you're not flattening anything)

    I get what you're trying to do, but how did you end up with Either[.., Either[..]] in the first place?
    I'll need to spend some time thinking about the laws for these typeclasses, for some reason I don't think the EitherT and ZIO instance in your example is behaving the same

    This is the definition of MonadError for EitherT

    implicit def catsDataMonadErrorFForEitherT[F[_], E, L](
        implicit FE0: MonadError[F, E]
      ): MonadError[EitherT[F, L, ?], E]

    So let's say your monad is EitherT[cats.effect.IO, MyError, Unit], the MonadError instance you have is MonadError[IO, Throwable]