These are chat archives for jdubray/sam

22nd
Oct 2017
Jean-Jacques Dubray
@jdubray
Oct 22 2017 08:08
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Jean-Jacques Dubray
@jdubray
Oct 22 2017 08:14
While these systems provided some of the benefits of a database system, they lacked many traditional database features that application developers often rely on. A key example is a robust query language, meaning that developers had to write complex code to process and aggregate the data in their applications. As a result, we decided to turn Spanner into a full featured SQL system, with query execution tightly integrated with the other architectural features of Spanner (such as strong consistency and global replication)
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 09:04
this discussion of node vs java is a bit stupid, no? node win in speed? also what they say about db access goes in the opposite direction of this url you just posted on sql ^^ even the simple building of nodejs is wrong to me (last time I tried to build a ts lib, I abandoned after a few hours of battling with "how the fuck do I build this?").
I only agree with json...
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 09:11
@jdubray unfortunately that article is wrong from the title.. the right title should be Node vs JVM
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 09:12
also yes :)
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 09:12
There's the wrong attitude to do one to one association from Java and the JVM, and that's sad
Java is a thing from the past, if you want the future, try kotlin, then try to do a comparison from a good architected API backend written in kotlin and vert.x for example (a few lines of code to have distributed system, security, static code analysis, no messy tests just to see if you named something wrong and so on) AND an API written in node, where the only thing you get is an hello world style API in few lines of code
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 09:17
With JavaScript or typescript obviously.. typescript just gives the wrong feeling of correctness, until you mix in some third party libraries with outdated or missing typings.. then you're out of luck
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 09:19
exactly my feeling
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 09:40
Node is a fantastic way to write tools or CLIs and other similar things, at least to me it stops here 😉
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 09:52
And.. if you want to read an article that tries NOT to be biased, try this https://rclayton.silvrback.com/speaking-intelligently-about-java-vs-node-performance
Apart from the discussion on performance comparison, the intro shares my own vision on the matter
(and it clearly denotes that he chose java in the title just to appear on top of serps)
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 10:02
Please note though that when the author speaks of java, he doesn't mention the advancements in frameworks like vert.x, where all the concurrency, clustering and balancing work is hidden from the dev, that can concentrate only on the business logic. Add that to three forms of concurrency to choose from, processes, threads or fibers, and one could achieve incredible throughput with assured correctness from the start
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 10:07
I played a bit with quasar and its fibers, but in the end it was too complex to manage because of the bytecode intrumentation. I will test vert.x one day I think :)
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 10:13
@victornoel and try kotlin if you haven't already 🤓 you won't regret it
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 10:16
ok :) I'm always a bit worried of alternate languages because of the potential of their disappearance (and in particular their IDEs) in the future. I used xtend for some time for example, but its strong ties to a given version of Eclipse was always a problem... I can do old Java with newer Eclipse version, but I'm less confident with xtend (as an exemple).
ah kotlin is from jetbrain? I suppose they don't plan to abandon supporting it in intellijidea then...
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 10:19
Kotlin has been chosen by gradle as an alternative to groovy, and probably they'll make it the main language, fading out groovy
Google made it an official alternative to java for writing android apps, and probably it will become THE way to write android apps
Kotlin is here to stay, and to push java to te edge as a mainstream language
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 10:21
nice
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 10:22
In addition kotlin compiles to JavaScript, with full support of third party libraries and existing code
And in little time it will compile to native code, for example for iOS and android, but also to windows, mac and Linux hosts
One language, 100% targets
One less known rumor, is that google will let write code that will compile both to the VM target and to native code, so that you will be able to mix both targets in the same project and choose the level you want to target
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 10:28
Java will slowly fade away if not able to evolve rapidly. Kotlin is one of the main reasons oracle chose to shorten the release cycle
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 10:34
kotlin's coroutines <3
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 10:36
Yeah, and more niceties to come.. it's rapidly evolving, but at the same time tries to be enterprise friendly, so no big surprises for existing code bases
Its compatibility with existing java code is unbeatable, no other language gives 100% code share like kotlin
You use java lib in kotlin, and you use kotlin lib in java, no compromises
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 11:10
@pfurini and which ide do you recommend for kotlin? the jetbrain's one? I'm more of a eclipse user :)
Paolo Furini
@pfurini
Oct 22 2017 12:32
jetbrain's of course gives you the best support.. and the best ide out there, TBH. I use IDEA based IDEs for every technology I use, alongside VSCode for lightweight work
I abandoned eclipse long time ago, and I think I'll never look back
if you want to try kotlin in a lighweight environment, go for vscode with kotlin plugin.. but please try downloading idea community edition, and try the java 2 kotlin converter to see what does it mean working with kotlin when coming from java
you can also see the opposite, that is you can see in realtime what java code kotlin compiles to..
Victor Noël
@victornoel
Oct 22 2017 12:45
nice, thx for the advice