These are chat archives for nightscout/intend-to-bolus

2nd
Sep 2015
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 00:40
@oskarpearson basically we're lazy. assumption is that it will be available GPL3 and maybe MIT or something more permissive as well.
if you would like to suggest something, feel free to do a pull request
would love to get more eyes on loop.sh
and iob.js and determine-basal.js for that matter
Nathan Racklyeft
@loudnate
Sep 02 2015 02:28
Hey all, I've just cut the first release of the openaps-historytools plugin. Special thanks to @channemann who added support for cleaning dexcom reports.
In the same spirit of the openaps-mmhistorytools plugin, the goal is to be a central place for documenting and testing issues with the native device reports.
So whether you're just investigating your health data or your full-on looping, these should be useful plugins.
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 02:36
Awesome @loudnate!
Chris Hannemann
@channemann
Sep 02 2015 06:19
+1 to both glucosetools and mmhistorytools, which are foundational in taking the "raw" outputs from openaps and cleaning them up for use in data investigation or looping
Oliver Schumacher
@oschumac
Sep 02 2015 09:36
Hi question which usb wlan stick is pervect for rpi2?
Oskar Pearson
@oskarpearson
Sep 02 2015 13:42
@oschumac I don't know that it hugely matters. As long as it says it's compatible with the pi, it'll probably just work without issues. If you want longer range, get one with an antenna. If you're in the USA https://www.adafruit.com/products/814 should work, as should millions of other options
Chris Hannemann
@channemann
Sep 02 2015 14:19
This one is fairly popular (and what a handful of us use): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003MTTJOY
Oliver Schumacher
@oschumac
Sep 02 2015 16:21
Yes this one o got. Maybe i am wrong but the build in antenna is poor. All other wlan device got a much better performance. I thought maybe there are better ones available.
Chris Hannemann
@channemann
Sep 02 2015 16:26
It isn't the best, but are there better ones with the same form factor? From what I've read, you need to go to a larger antenna size--and therefore larger USB dongle--to improve the range.
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 17:13
I know there are a few new pumps out, there is one thats water tight and suppose to have a app for the phone next year or at the end of the year..... anyone know about that one?
I was wondering if there was any real good ability to steal its data it uploads to the online site for better reporting
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 17:16
We don't know about any future pumps yet
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 17:24
ok
Oliver Schumacher
@oschumac
Sep 02 2015 17:34
dana pump has an android app. Which is capable of bolus temp everything we dream of.
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 17:35
wow
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 17:35
Yea. We were talking to SOIL about it earlier in the year, I don't have a lot of hopes for getting access to it in the US but hopefully elsewhere it might be avail and usable
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 17:36
yeah the govt wouldn't approve of it.
Oliver Schumacher
@oschumac
Sep 02 2015 17:36
DANA Mobile (1).jpg
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 17:36
There was some limiting feature but I don't remember what it was, maybe something to do with setting basals from the app being not built in?
Not so much that, they just seem to have very little experience navigating fda.
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 17:37
how about a BG meter that has an app?
Oliver Schumacher
@oschumac
Sep 02 2015 17:39
Dana has an Meter as remote. Windows software and Android app. All are capable of bolus and temp. I had one for testing. But pump ampulla has very poor hardware. Pump needs spezial battery which is only produced in Korea.
kenstack
@kenstack
Sep 02 2015 17:51
@oschumac I believe @LorelaiL Has one - I think she wrote about some issues like noise I remember - you may want to contact her
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 17:51
hm
I mean now that technology is pretty well out there.
I am sure you could make a BG meter with raspberry or arduino
just saying
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 17:53
@oschumac Yes, remembering now that battery is a big deal. Proprietary parts like that make me nervous.
Especially since a loop requires more power because of frequency of communication
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 19:28
@timomer saw your Qs about Roche pump, have you figured out how to write to it yet? Someone was asking me about other pumps beside medtronic, bu t wasn't sure if anyone had successfully written to anything else yet
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 19:58
@danamlewis have you had any more conversations with FDA/medtronic about this/getting into their external research program?
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:00
@bewest Sort of. FDA doesn't want us to go the IDE route and neither do we, because they'd require us to have a traditional researcher and all kinds of extra stuff that seem excessive and unnecessary. We realized that we could do a "bench study" without needing an IDE, so I resubmitted my research application to Medtronic in early July as a bench study. I didn't hear back, so last week had re-pinged and was told Medtronic would look into it.
Medtronic had originally said "yes" to our application but that we needed an IDE. So trying to find out if their answer changes if we want it for a bench study, or they're just being slow :)
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:01
yeah
Paul Andrel
@stavlor
Sep 02 2015 20:01
heh
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:01
how much is in scope? there must be some mechanism for communication?
would be interesting to see some of the materials
I really need to do something quickly :-(
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:02
FDA had thought that the MiniMed Connect (read only) was what we were originally asking for, which is why they reviewed it so quickly…but we were asking for a read/write device to use. Medtronic calls them both "translators", so that confused FDA when they'd been sitting on our IDE application for use of a Medtronic 'translator' and then Medtronic submitted their translator (ie the read-only Connect) for approval. So once we clarified that we needed read-write, we circled back to where we were before
@bewest do something quickly about what?
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:03
I'm now paying cash for everything, no health insurance, and low on supplies to boot
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:04
No insurance? Not using the exchange?
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:04
so getting into some program with medtronic/fda would help alleviate a tiny bit of stress somewhere... I'm also tired of the stigma
Paul Andrel
@stavlor
Sep 02 2015 20:04
@bewest ouch thats no fun
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:05
certain diabetes companies decided to not even call me back for chat/interview, that was surprising, so would be nice to have as much interaction with FDA documented as possible
since it seems to be having an affect on job placement somehow
so, they are both translators
it's not a necessarily read-only device, I believe
but I think you have to know some magic to get it to do non-write stuff
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:07
Presumably they have it turned off so you can't write to pump. But ya, wondering if like Dexcom there's a way. Guess we'll find out when it comes out
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:07
but it's read-only in the same sense that rileylink is readonly, basically
which is to say, not at all...
the designed use case is not for write
so they aren't "claiming" it for marketing/FDA, etc...
so FDA would indeed be pretty confused....
not sure medtronic understands what they just did...
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:09
As far as I can tell, they're two difference kinds of devices. But you may be right. Regardless, not sure we'd be able to tell about the Connect until it comes out and can play with it.
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:09
you can't "turn it off" like that
it's functionally equivalent to rileylink
rileylink is "read-only" same way connect is... it's designed with it's app to do read-only
that's the use case
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:10
I think they could have designed the translator to only allow an approved list of commands to be translated
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:10
doesn't mean it can't do writes if you present it with the right frames and the pump knows those frames
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:10
Insurance sucks. Straight up. Just received blood product from hospital that comes from 1000s of donors and costs 1000s of dollars each time I get it every 2 weeks.
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:10
not sure if they did: we need to get connects to play with
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:10
by default, on the default interface, yes...
I'm trying to let you know I know something about it ;-)
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:11
Ahhhh
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:11
I would expect it to be like RileyLink
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:11
and that the marketing claims here are BS
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:11
oh, ok
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:11
I see :)
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:11
I'm not sure they understand what they are claiming
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:11
I like having actual knowledge :)
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:11
Medtronic is big on marketing tho
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:11
they are creating a situation for additional surprises
with the way they are playing this with FDA/security
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:12
Oh...
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:12
at least until 640 takes over
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:13
Does 640 live up to its hype?
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:13
what hype? it can't be controlled properly
that makes it a pretty serious risk to me
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:13
The "promise" of predictive glucose suspend that they have been marketing
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:13
@bewest define "properly"?
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:14
it's just like when you own a car
I can open up the hood and tinker around, change the oil...
I can go to any workshop to get someone else to do it
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:14
Nerd talk
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:14
or find a friend to do it
same applies here, someone in community should be able to step it through a local debugger
run the commands to trace through and control steps on their own
Pete Schwamb
@ps2
Sep 02 2015 20:16
Has anyone received a minimed connect yet? My order has been in “processing documents” since mid july.
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:16
write apps on top of it using the data... change the way it works the same way as buttons using the right tools
Dana Lewis
@danamlewis
Sep 02 2015 20:16
@ps2 didn't bother to order one but sounds like maybe we should
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:16
if it's impossible for the world to do that, you can't "own" it or control it
otherwise it's all appeal to authority... there's no way to reproduce, verify how it works
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 20:21
idk if im late to the party but Dexcom is supposedly read-only its the only way fda will approve it, just spoke with my docter about that one the other day.
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:22
what does that mean?
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 20:22
uhhhhh the app for the phone to the dexcom is supposed to recieve only.
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:22
dexcom is clearly not read-only, you can flash firmware and change the boot parameters among other things
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 20:22
oooooo
wow really?
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:23
over USB, not bluetooth
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:23
dexcom themselves shipped a firmware update this year
that was before they had bluetooth
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 20:23
ok
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:23
the bluetooth is the same protocol... over bluetooth
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:23
Yeah that's pretty cool
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:23
I don't know if it works or not, but would seem reasonable for it to work
especially since they are saying future is ble only
no usb port
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 20:24
hm
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:24
likewise FDA has explicitly encouraged industry to do faster firmware/os updates
repeatedly, actually
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:24
well, dexcom's future BLE stuff is only for talking to the transmitter, not receiver
and there'll be no need to flash transmitters: they only last 3 months
any code that will need to be upgradable is in the mobile app
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:25
dexcom plans on eliminating receiver
g5 is ble
g6 is no receiver
their going to lean on "mobile dexcom"
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:26
right. so no firmware to talk to
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:26
there is lots of firmware to talk to
the whole transmitter system
has ton of firmware they'll want to be updating
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:26
I bet they don't make it upgradable
it's got a 3 month lifetime hardcoded
so they'll just ship new firmware in new transmitters
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:27
mine just lasted a year
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:27
apparently g5 dies after 3 months whether battery is dead or not
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:27
heh
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:27
or so goes the rumor
Geramy
@Geramy
Sep 02 2015 20:27
isn't dexcom coming out with a new system?
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:27
ok, that's interesting
g5, g6
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:27
we'll see, but its battery gets used up much faster with all the extra stuff it's doing in the transmitter
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:28
if the firmware can be influenced, that'll be a popular hack to modify it
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:28
heh ya
Ben West
@bewest
Sep 02 2015 20:28
I can see what you're saying, too
Paul Andrel
@stavlor
Sep 02 2015 20:29
right when they actually ship the G5 the plan is to push out an upgrade for recievers to be able to talk to it well for share receivers don't think they plan on an update for non-share recievers
Scott Leibrand
@scottleibrand
Sep 02 2015 20:30
yeah, as long as they still sell receivers, they'll still be upgradable over USB
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 20:37
Dang I just read an article about how sketchy plasma donation is, as they pay their donors. I rely on blood plasma products from paid donors so it really makes me feel good. Also, the poor use it as a way to scrape by. Sad. There is an unknown risk of getting prion diseases from it. http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/05/blood-money-the-twisted-business-of-donating-plasma/362012/
I am getting chills right now so I hope I am not getting sick from whatever.
But yeah Share is awesome
Pete Schwamb
@ps2
Sep 02 2015 21:31
minimed connect still isn’t shipping for anyone apparently.
diabeticgonewild
@diabeticgonewild
Sep 02 2015 22:07
That sucks. I'm going to bed. Tired and had a long day.
Oskar Pearson
@oskarpearson
Sep 02 2015 22:29
Feel better..
Lori
@LoriLori
Sep 02 2015 22:59
lets dream , one day omnipod pod will talk ble and controled via phone or G5 transmitter :)
think that would increase material cost of pods by 15cents :( which is never a good news
Lori
@LoriLori
Sep 02 2015 23:13
about DanaR, connection is reliable, but records in pump has its limitations
  1. basal history is per hours total
  1. temp basal history only says on/off
temp basal duration is in 1 hour increments, and 10% increments/decrements max 100%
thus we will need to store all history somewhere else, at least when command for temp is send, we can confirm it is active and its amounts
there seems to be option for 1/2 hours basal history and settings but nobody knows how to enable it
considering in need for positive temp basal for 1/2 hour, in case of permanent loose of connection this is a risk
noise of pump, I think all pumps make some kind of noise , can't compare it
Lori
@LoriLori
Sep 02 2015 23:19
battery life is still a question , think they designed it for at least few connections per day, but BT 2.0 as far as I know has 15mA when not connected but 6mA when connected, thus when always connected it should actually save a battery, just a theory
I am still not wearing it :( connection to body in hospital is pending
whole APS port to android pending, think will start with low suspend is Mdt predictive fashion
think people in UK are using for last few years in theirs research
Florence-s.jpg
mostly positive
@Geramy
Lori
@LoriLori
Sep 02 2015 23:31
if somebody remembers Cozmo pump , dana r is what Cozmo has become or it is based on, licensed I don't know
and yes it is at least 5 years old design, but so are others I think, it takes a lot of time to go through the whole cycle of medical thing design
if we just take a look at recently released pump components, most of them are out of life (replaced by new versions) allready