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  • Aug 11 2021 20:52
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Ghost
@ghost~57bc59d440f3a6eec060e93b
therein; the ability to use WebID-OIDC ‘over the top’, for user/profile AUTH
noting also, HbbTV’s and the like can accept TLS certificates. I’ve not tested writing a HbbTV app, that draws personalisation settings from a pod; but, its an interesting way to improve privacy, imho...

noting - this is from ~2013? http://mediaprophet.org/ux_KB/page4115294.html

Kinda illustrated my view, about how to make use of WebID-TLS certs...

Mitzi László
@Mitzi-Laszlo
@mediaprophet would you like to raise an issue for the next W3C Solid Community Group agenda ?
Ghost
@ghost~57bc59d440f3a6eec060e93b
(http headers say - uploaded 29 Oct 2013 03:14:32 GMT, so, lots been done since then)
Ghost
@ghost~57bc59d440f3a6eec060e93b

@Mitzi-Laszlo not at this stage. I’ll have to do some work on presentation materials, that provides a broader ecosystems ‘concept overview’, as to incorporate AR (Augmented Reality - the web of ‘space’ / real-world), Web of Things, Naturalised interfaces and the relationship between interactivity and various ‘AI’ (inc. media processing, signatures, etc.) considerations; perhaps also, supply chains (ie: food), health, ‘smart cities’, ‘commons informatics’ (inc. open-data), societal systems, etc.

It’s only really at web-scale does this vastly more sophistocated solutions framework, start to demonstrate the attentive purpose, of doing things that are more complex than json/graphql.

Ghost
@ghost~57bc59d440f3a6eec060e93b
@bblfish re: Community Group Agenda - i remember some years ago, you spoke about the idea of ones own personal ontology / ontology creation ‘thing’, perhaps you remember and can describe to others?
Justin Bingham
@justinwb
@AJunque9 Check out LDN (Linked Data Notifications) for context - https://www.w3.org/TR/ldn/
Henry Story
@bblfish
I suppose one could write an ontology development app. A bit like Protege perhaps. Not that easy to do really well.
Ana Junquera Méndez
@AJunque9
@angelo-v @justinwb thank you very much!
konobi
@konobi
@bblfish I can think of a couple of folks who'd have an interest in that
Tim Berners-Lee
@timbl
@megoth_twitter is one
An app to just allow you to edit an ontology could be relaively simple if you are making a simple ontology using RDFS and minimal OWL. bUt the trick is editing and spotting the relationships with other ontologies, anddoing PREs into other peoples terms … the cpollaborative bit
Ghost
@ghost~57bc59d440f3a6eec060e93b

is 42?

I remember BBLFish discussing it as an objective project sometime ago.

One idea about how the UX might work in my mind, thought about the ability to expand upon the mind-mapping type of interfaces, but perhaps, introduce 3d - which has been done for mindmapping, but not for ontology work.

thereafter, in anycase: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-solid/2019Apr/0020.html which i see as complimentary to notes previously made https://www.webizen.net.au/?s=modal

Ghost
@ghost~57bc59d440f3a6eec060e93b

@timbl re: https://www.lifehacker.com.au/2019/04/berners-lee-says-weve-messed-up-the-internet-but-it-can-be-fixed/ & therein, "Berners-Lee noted that an article with the headline "Clinton wanted Trump to win" was created by a group of schoolchildren in Macedonia and collected the largest Google ad payoff for a single story ever recorded. “

Do you have a pointer to cite?

I think, Good outcomes for forming a complimentary approach, will be good for the solid community
Ghost
@ghost~5c87f5d4d73408ce4fba6e3b

@mediaprophet I would so love to work on something like that, the problem is that I dont have the juice to do much myself. I still have good ideas and I can write code, but to keep going I need collaborators. I don't think I'm so different in that either. People are inspired in a group setting. That doesn't mean freeloading either. I read somewhere that the average shelf life of a coder is 5 years. So where do they go after that? Do they die, or maybe lose their minds? I don't think so. There are a lot of coders who are not students but are doing other things and who have some time, just not full time, to contribute. As the price of coding, just like music or other arts, gets driven down this is the case. But here's the thing about coders. They have to be invited. Not sneered at or told to wait until revelations come from the inner sanctum. Not just expected to show up like fraternity pledges. That doesn't cost much if you don't insist on approving every line of code and you settle instead for accepting what works. That is maybe hard to do but necessary. If a space can be created for a group of unvetted coders to do their thing but with some help with goals and benchmarks set in a sincere manner by the vetted ones, it could maybe lead to some productive outcomes. The key I think is usefulness, you will get more volunteers if their stuff is used. How do you make use of unevaluated code from unevaluated volunteers without spending much on evaluators? There should be a way. Personally I think web components could be very helpful, and maybe some innovative processes are needed too.

Full disclosure: I used to be tag42git on github but in a fit of pique I deleted that account so I have switched identities, same gender though. I'm still tag42git on the forum.

Christophe
@Psycop_twitter
At all: @dsebastien @SuperITMan @RubenVerborgh and some other Members here Say Hi from our 2day data democracy hackathon in Ghent Belgium today!
(It's on Solid, GDPR, getting data on a pod, coming up with business ideas that can attract customers to a pod)
Fabian Cook
@fabiancook
Whats the average career span here? I'm @ 6-7 years now...
Arne Hassel
@megoth_twitter
I’ve been a full-time programmer for 7 years or so, but worked part-time and studied for five years before that, doing a lot of programming then as well
Fabian Cook
@fabiancook
Nice. What languages have you been working with?
I try and get a diverse range of languages in.

Atm I'm using Java & JavaScript for a lot of things from small 50 people companies, to software thats been key to some projects requiring ~300 mil transactions to be processed in a short amount of time.

Where I'm working on Java, its usually to bridge them to the world of JavaScript

Arne Hassel
@megoth_twitter
JavaScript, HTML and CSS has always been at the center for my work as front-end developer, but I’ve also touched upon C# and Java with various frameworks, mostly to work on APIs that I needed for the various front-end applications
I did work with a framework called Enonic XP which enabled me to work with JavaScript on the backend through Nashorn, which was ok most of the time, but could also be quite hellish at its worst =P
now I try to focus mostly on JavaScript, HTML and CSS and hope that Solid servers can give me most of what I need wrt back end functionality ^_^
Ghost
@ghost~57bc59d440f3a6eec060e93b
I've been onto what's now moreover known as solid, atm, for ~19 years (since 2000, when I wrote a paper about an "iBank", inspired by a relatives work that won.him a Nobel prize (function of.synaptic nerve cells, John carew eccles) and my.Application of.that theory to.online data storage; moving forward, @sideshowtom, I'll follow-up.
konobi
@konobi
@megoth_twitter @timbl I'd think that perhaps a model toward that, would be to collaboratively work on definitions by creating the AST directly, rather than through text... which could be further constrained by shex.
Tim Berners-Lee
@timbl
AST?
konobi
@konobi
abstract syntax tree
Tim Berners-Lee
@timbl
Of an ontology for example?
konobi
@konobi
Yup... having the tree available would also allow for a spot for contributors to add annotations to specific nodes or group of nodes as the modelling is ongoing, add commentary on the domain specifics or things that would be non-obvious to an observer that is not a domain expert
Sina Bahram
@sinabahram
Hi all, I've been following Solid from afar for a little while now with some considerable excitement for all of the obvious reasons around privacy, decentralization, etc., but I'm sad to say that every experience I've had with Solid has been rather poor. The reason for this is that I happen to be blind, so I use a screen reader. I understand that things are very much in a prototyping stage at this point, but I think that standards conformance like adhering to markup validation and also the rather well-documented success criteria from WCAG 2.1 align completely with the values of TBL and others behind this important and significant work. When things don't start out accessible, they very rarely ever become so. An inclusive design methodology can really help here, as there seems to already be various tooling being built around the various apps in Solid from different providers (I'm still learning the lingo, by the way, so sorry if I mess that up). This kind of inertia will only grow, and if accessibility is not being considered from the beginning, then I would consider that an incredible tragedy for work as important as this. I will try to follow this channel, but this interface is not the most accessible, ironically enough, so please forgive me if there are delays in response or an absense of feedback. If there's someone that's an appropriate individual to have a longer in-depth email or phone conversation with, I'd be happy to do so. I happen to also be an expert in accessibility, with a focus on web accessibility, so I am very much willing to put my time and effort where my words are, but I feele it important to note that accessibility should hopefully be a basic tenant of this work so we do not inadvertently continue the exclusion of persons with disabilities, amongst others, due to the inaccessibility of the various interfaces surrounding this project. I'm sorry to open with a "complaint" so to speak, but I feel this is super critical, and I hope there's an opportunity to rapidly enhance the accessibility of the various interfaces and perhaps enforce accessibility as strictly as any privacy and security concerns, which is a principle that I trust this group of amazing people agrees with. Thank you for anything/everything you can do to help make Solid better for all people of various abilities, and also sorry for the long opener.
Jeff Zucker
@jeff-zucker
@sinabahram Thank you so much for raising this issue. I agree that it is critically important and would really value your help and suggestion. Perhaps there should be a working group of some kind - I'd certainly participate.
thatmikehill
@thatmikehill
Hello all, I’m Michael.
I want to introduce myself to you as someone who is following solid and taken an interest in the Dataist movement.
I will be the first to admit to you I’m 100% clueless to all things dev but I’m doing what I can to educate myself and be a part of the community.
I’m a complete NeWb and I don’t know anything yet but I’m working hard to educate myself and learn things.
I hope I can be accepted even though I’m not a dev or programmer.
I look forward to learning. 👍🏻
konobi
@konobi
@sinabahram as a fellow disabled person, I'm certainly keeping it way up my list of priorities. Expertise in the area is very much appreciated. I believe both @megoth_twitter and @eduardoinnorway are likely to be people that would be interested in applying that expertise.
Jeff Zucker
@jeff-zucker
@sinabahram you should also post your intro on the Solid Forum ... @Mitzi-Laszlo is the community manager and may have some suggestions about where such a working group might live.
@thatmikehill welcome! We need thinkers and testers and promoters as well as developers. You should introduce yourself on the forum
Sarven Capadisli
@csarven
@sinabahram Welcome! I couldn't agree more with you, and it is so good to have you here. By all means, please continue to provide feedback when you can. I'd be super interested in having your feedback on https://dokie.li/ - the content there is more or less what the application can produce, or at least the intention when all of the components are working smoothly :) WCAG is a top-priority. ATAG and UUAG are also on the map. If you'd like to discuss further, eg. features you'd like to use, there is a dedicated public chat at https://gitter.im/linkeddata/dokieli .
Sina Bahram
@sinabahram
Thanks so much, all. I'll check out the various links. Plane is bout to take off but more form me later on. Thank you for the warm welcome!
Tim Berners-Lee
@timbl
@sscheper Correct usage is Solid pod, no caps on POD
Arne Hassel
@megoth_twitter
@sinabahram thank you for raising this issue, it is super critical! I'm putting heavy emphasis on this in the revamp of the data browser, and I hope we can create a much more accessible
Would it be ok for me to contact you when we've started the work on the data browser? I would love help to ensure that we include everyone
The Arkadia
@thearkadia
@timbl have you went through any of the source code of https://morph.is/v0.8/
the goal is very similar to solid and it was started a couple years ago but never got much attention
Phil Wheeler
@Phil-Wheeler
Hi folks. I've seen some work around a more concrete social client from @melvincarvalho some time back and wondered whether there was any traction on this or other similar application? Has anyone prototyped out a "Facebook replacement" that could be considered at an alpha / beta stage? Is there intent or current work underway within the community toward building something outside the basic microblogging / Twitter use case?
Jeff Zucker
@jeff-zucker
@Phil-Wheeler see this posting on the forum
Phil Wheeler
@Phil-Wheeler
@jeff-zucker Funnily enough, it was another post from that same author that I'd read as well: https://safenetforum.org/t/solid-social-decentralised-social-network-using-linked-data-solid/17385
And thanks for sharing that link. It still doesn't quite look like what I'd consider to be something that the typical non-technical user would view as being a potential alternative to their expectation of "a social network", but it does look like a very interesting blogging platform!