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Jeff Zucker
@jeff-zucker
@sinabahram Thank you so much for raising this issue. I agree that it is critically important and would really value your help and suggestion. Perhaps there should be a working group of some kind - I'd certainly participate.
thatmikehill
@thatmikehill
Hello all, I’m Michael.
I want to introduce myself to you as someone who is following solid and taken an interest in the Dataist movement.
I will be the first to admit to you I’m 100% clueless to all things dev but I’m doing what I can to educate myself and be a part of the community.
I’m a complete NeWb and I don’t know anything yet but I’m working hard to educate myself and learn things.
I hope I can be accepted even though I’m not a dev or programmer.
I look forward to learning. 👍🏻
konobi
@konobi
@sinabahram as a fellow disabled person, I'm certainly keeping it way up my list of priorities. Expertise in the area is very much appreciated. I believe both @megoth_twitter and @eduardoinnorway are likely to be people that would be interested in applying that expertise.
Jeff Zucker
@jeff-zucker
@sinabahram you should also post your intro on the Solid Forum ... @Mitzi-Laszlo is the community manager and may have some suggestions about where such a working group might live.
@thatmikehill welcome! We need thinkers and testers and promoters as well as developers. You should introduce yourself on the forum
Sarven Capadisli
@csarven
@sinabahram Welcome! I couldn't agree more with you, and it is so good to have you here. By all means, please continue to provide feedback when you can. I'd be super interested in having your feedback on https://dokie.li/ - the content there is more or less what the application can produce, or at least the intention when all of the components are working smoothly :) WCAG is a top-priority. ATAG and UUAG are also on the map. If you'd like to discuss further, eg. features you'd like to use, there is a dedicated public chat at https://gitter.im/linkeddata/dokieli .
Sina Bahram
@sinabahram
Thanks so much, all. I'll check out the various links. Plane is bout to take off but more form me later on. Thank you for the warm welcome!
Tim Berners-Lee
@timbl
@sscheper Correct usage is Solid pod, no caps on POD
Arne Hassel
@megoth_twitter
@sinabahram thank you for raising this issue, it is super critical! I'm putting heavy emphasis on this in the revamp of the data browser, and I hope we can create a much more accessible
Would it be ok for me to contact you when we've started the work on the data browser? I would love help to ensure that we include everyone
The Arkadia
@thearkadia
@timbl have you went through any of the source code of https://morph.is/v0.8/
the goal is very similar to solid and it was started a couple years ago but never got much attention
Phil Wheeler
@Phil-Wheeler
Hi folks. I've seen some work around a more concrete social client from @melvincarvalho some time back and wondered whether there was any traction on this or other similar application? Has anyone prototyped out a "Facebook replacement" that could be considered at an alpha / beta stage? Is there intent or current work underway within the community toward building something outside the basic microblogging / Twitter use case?
Jeff Zucker
@jeff-zucker
@Phil-Wheeler see this posting on the forum
Phil Wheeler
@Phil-Wheeler
@jeff-zucker Funnily enough, it was another post from that same author that I'd read as well: https://safenetforum.org/t/solid-social-decentralised-social-network-using-linked-data-solid/17385
And thanks for sharing that link. It still doesn't quite look like what I'd consider to be something that the typical non-technical user would view as being a potential alternative to their expectation of "a social network", but it does look like a very interesting blogging platform!
thatmikehill
@thatmikehill
@Phil-Wheeler I think you’re correct, most non-techies won’t even have any clue what to do with it. I can say this because I’m one of them. I have a POD with STACK now (I think that’s what it’s called)
And I have know clue what the heck I doing or what it’s really for or how to use it. 😆
But I’m trusting I’ll learn little by little and there is a movement and vision that Tim Berners Lee has and I don’t know dev or programming, but I want to be a part of it.
So some, maybe very few of us non-technicals will be here with ya. 😁
“The web as I envisaged it, we have not seen it yet. The future is still so much bigger than the past.” - TimBL
Phil Wheeler
@Phil-Wheeler
@thatmikehill Heh. Yeah - stick with it. I think there's a slowly-growing discomfort with the walled gardens where you are the product. I'm a web developer on the .Net stack by trade, so I'm technically capable but I'm not going to launch into rolling my own app if there's already a good candidate out there.
Angelo Veltens
@angelo-v
We have at least two different list of solid apps, which differ much. One at the w3c wiki and the other in the solid/solid-apps GitHub repo Since it inevitable that those lists diverge, and surely will again even if we try to "clean up" I think we should decide for one location. Are there any preferences for one or the other or reasons to keep both?
Angelo Veltens
@angelo-v
And I propose we have a similar list for solid libraries
Mark Hughes (happybeing/theWebalyst)
@happybeing

Here's a weird one, working on Plume I'm trying to use solid-auth-client fetch (which maps to rdflib) to overwrite config.json with PUT. The same put() function is used for saving blog posts with '.ttl' extension and content type 'rdf/turtle' and I've also tried saving to a '.txt' file with content type 'text/plain'. Here's the function:

    var put = function(url, data, type) {
        let contentType = type || 'text/turtle'
        var init = {
                    method: 'PUT',
                    headers : {
                       'Content-Type': contentType,
                       'Content-Length': data.length
                    },
                    credentials: 'include',
                   }
        if (data && data.length > 0) {
          init['body'] = data;
        }

        var promise = Solid.fetch(url, init)
               .then((resp) => {
                  if (resp.status === 200 || resp.status === 201) {
                    return Promise.resolve(parseResponseMeta(resp))
                  } else {
                    return Promise.reject({status: resp.status, msg: resp.statusText})
                  }
               })
        return promise;
    };

When I try to save to a file 'config.json' with content type 'application/json' the response is 200, and the file is overwritten but empty. Just changing the content type to 'text/plain' causes the content to be written to a file with a different name ('config$.txt'). Any ideas?

Mark Hughes (happybeing/theWebalyst)
@happybeing
I'm wondering if rdflib doesn't like the 'body' I'm sending, which is the output of JSON.stringify(config,null,4) which looks like this:
"{
    "owners": [
        "https://localhost:8443/profile/card#me"
    ],
    "title": "Plume (sac-smalinin)",
    "tagline": "Light as a feather",
    "picture": "img/logo.svg",
    "fadeText": true,
    "showSources": true,
    "cacheUnit": "days",
    "defaultPath": "public/posts",
    "postsURL": "https://localhost:8443/public/posts/",
    "saveDate": 1555152421986,
    "postsElement": ".posts",
    "loadInBg": false
}"
Just changing the PUT to write to config.txt with type 'text/plain' works. Does rdflib fetch expect something different for 'application/json'?
Or maybe its a node-solid-server thing?
Mark Hughes (happybeing/theWebalyst)
@happybeing
For now I'm just going to switch to config.txt and 'text/plain' but it would be nice to know how to write a file with '.json' extension.
Angelo Veltens
@angelo-v
Did you try just JSON.stringify(config)?
Not sure how the indentation is handled...
Another option would be to save the config as ttl and request jsonld if the client relies on a json serialization
Jeff Zucker
@jeff-zucker
you have to supply a body in the init
oh nevermind, there it is
why is the content type text/turtle rather than application/json?
Alain Bourgeois
@bourgeoa
This message was deleted
This message was deleted
Alain Bourgeois
@bourgeoa
@theWebalyst It seems to be solved in v5.0.1 solid/node-solid-server#1165
Alain Bourgeois
@bourgeoa
I made a how-to to build a docker solid server on a Synology Nas see : solidforum and solid-wiki for beginners
Mark Hughes (happybeing/theWebalyst)
@happybeing

@bourgeoa thanks for looking but I'm using 5.0.1 :wink:
@jeff-zucker 'text/turtle' is the default but I'm specifying 'application/json' for the '.json' file.

It works with config.txt and 'text/plain' but I get a zero length file if I use config.json and 'application/json'.

I'm going to settle for config.txt, but no doubt we'll want to PUT json files at some point.

Mark Hughes (happybeing/theWebalyst)
@happybeing
what's the easiest way for an ordinary person to upload a directory tree to a folder on their pod?
I'm using solid-filemanager but this doesn't recurse directories, which is going to be laborious for ordinary folks
Sina Bahram
@sinabahram
@jeff-zucker, Thanks for the welcome, and I'm willing to join that WG. I don't know the governance structures in play here, so I leave that to others to formally oranize, but I'm in.
@konobi, glad to hear other users of assistive technologies and users with disabilities are already part of the conversation. There's a working group idea being suggested as part of this conversation, and I think it would be a good idea for many of us who are AT users to make sure to join said WG so we can make actionable suggestions.
@jeff-zucker, I will attempt to do so RE the forum. My major concern is the good outcome of potentially getting responses but then needing to navigate another inaccessible experience to respond to them. I'm willing to do so, as I said before, but if there's a channel or place you'd think would get the most traction, given the difficulty of interacting on some of these interfaces, that would be good to know.
@csarven, I looked at dokie.li, while some semantics are there, the links in the TOC don't seem keyboard accessible (they don't do anything when activated) and they are phrased as same-page links to ankors elsewhere, even though they aren't. Some of those structures are better conveyed via some aria semantics that I'm happy to show you. Also, touching up the heading order (especially through the use of some offscreen sr-only headings) as well as the use of html5 regions would help a great deal. I could be wrong on this last observation, but there may also be a disconnect between the visual order of some of your components there and the logical DOM order, which is something to be avoided, especially for sighted keyboard-only users who rely on this mapping to remain consistent. We should also discuss menu semantics and your intent for that menu going forward as it would drastically affect which markup pattern I recommend to you. Happy to discuss further. Gitter isn't the greatest, but I'm able to make this work, as long as messages aren't flying across, since there's no easy way to review other than painstakeningly arrowing through content, but I'm willing to hop on there as well if you feel that to be the best.
@megoth_twitter, absolutely fee free to contact me. Email would be prefered if at all possible, but I'm then happy to help walk through various markup patterns and offer advice on implementation at whatever level you're ready to receive said advice. We can hop on a call, and I can share my screen so you can map visual components to how the DOM is being exposed to the various assistive technology (AT) stacks.
Sarven Capadisli
@csarven
@sinabahram Thanks for the technical bits. Before I respond to that.. what would you prefer? Would IRC/Freenode work for you?
Sina Bahram
@sinabahram
@csarven, For long-form async text, email is best, but for synchronous, that's a really tricky situation these days. It used to be that everything from IRC to MSN to Skype and many others were reasonably accessible, but due to recent changes that's not the case anymore. I'm working with the RipCord developer on their native client for Slack and Discord to try to restore this situation, but a Zoom audio call where I can also share my screen may be the best (I can host us as my company has an account). I can go play with the latest version of Chatzilla to see if that would be a reasonable way of interfacing with IRC (it used to be, but I remember many changes degrading that experience over time).
Sarven Capadisli
@csarven
Zoom or alike works for me.
https://talky.io/ is pretty good. No account needed and it is p2p.
Sina Bahram
@sinabahram
@csarven, should we schedule a call over email perhaps so we don't spam this channel with logistics?
Also, if it would be helpful for multiple people who are generating UIs on top of solid to join a call where we can get a group benefit of going over some of these concepts, I'd be willing to do that in the future too. That way, multiple folks can learn from each others' questions and all that.
Sarven Capadisli
@csarven
@sinabahram As you like. Email: info@csarven.ca . dokieli Gitter chat is at https://gitter.im/linkeddata/dokieli when you'd like to drop by.