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    Valerie Sutton
    @signwriting_twitter
    Thank you, Amit, and thank you Steve! This is very exciting and I look forward to trying this. Chat with you at 8:00am PDT!
    Valerie Sutton
    @signwriting_twitter
    I am on Zoom ;-)
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Saturday office hours are open.
    Valerie Sutton
    @signwriting_twitter
    Good morning, Steve! Thank you for being here so early on a Saturday morning. I will turn on Zoom ;-)
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Great chat Val. It's amazing to hear about all of the SignWriting projects that are happening behind the scenes.
    Valerie Sutton
    @signwriting_twitter
    Yes Steve. It was a great chat this morning! This week was an amazing week. There is no way for you or me to know about the projects using SignWriting in the world without someone telling us about them ;-) This week I learned about 4 different projects, from 4 different countries, that I did not know existed. So I hope people feel free to write to us to share news about their projects and to ask for assistance with software and/or writing issues if need be. my email: sutton@signwriting.org
    Valerie Sutton
    @signwriting_twitter
    Thank you, Steve, for giving us our SignWriting server, both old and new, and the encoding of the ISWA 2010, and software, such as SignPuddle 2 and SignMaker 2017, to use the ISWA 2010. There are several software programs in the world for SignWriting that "piggyback" on your work - accessing the dictionaries and databases for example in SignPuddle 2 and then using that written data to provide different formats for users - but without your foundation software and our server, SignWriting would be inaccessible. SignWriting users are so fortunate for your gifts to the world, Steve. I hope users will visit your web page to contribute: https://steveslevinski.me
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Saturday office hours are open. It's been a great week finding out about several new SignWriting projects.
    Valerie Sutton
    @signwriting_twitter
    Good morning Steve and everyone - I bet it was an interesting week. Want to chat this morning? Maybe in an hour, at the top of the next hour? 8:00am Pacific - hope to see you then -
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Sounds great Val. Talk to you soon.
    Valerie Sutton
    @signwriting_twitter
    OK! I am going to Zoom now ;-)
    Argonist
    @Argonist
    Hello I come from Germany and am joining in delegs-project. We, delegs-Team, are preparing to create new font for german sign writing. We want to import the list all symbols with metadatas of https://www.signbank.org/iswa/ in airtable. Airtable accepts only csv-file to import the data in Airtable. Where can we get a csv-file from ISWA-website?
    In Character Viewer (http://signbank.org/SignWriting_Character_Viewer.html#?ui=en&set=pua) there are two versions of viewer. v1 is used unicode 8 block (U+1D800 - U+1D9FF). But v2 is used the diffenrent unicode block(U+40001-???). Which unicode should we use?
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    There are two options for unicode. You can use the official Unicode 8 specification. It contains all of the symbols, but none of the number characters or structural markers. It uses facial diacritics which I have rejected in the past because it was a nightmare to fully design and implement. In 2020, Google released the Noto Sans SignWriting Regular font which does support facial diacritics. It does not support all platforms or browsers, but it is usable in certain situations.
    Option two for unicode is SignWriting in Unicode (SWU), an experimental Unicode design that is not part of the Unicode standard. SignWriting in Unicode (SWU) was released in 2017. It is fully compatible with Formal SignWriting in ASCII (FSW).
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    A third option for the ISWA is using plane 15 for the symbol line and plane 16 for the symbol fill.
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Go ahead and search through the references I have on the ISWA 2010: https://steveslevinski.me/#standard2010
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    You should be able to find the data you are looking for. Some assembly required for a properly formatted csv. This is the type of work I'm happy to do for partners and above. If you'd like to support my work, maybe you or someone you know can join the patreon campaign at $10 a month or more. https://www.patreon.com/signwriting
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Saturday office hour are open.
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Thanks @Argonist for letting us know about a new font project for Delegs. I noticed that https://sign2mint.de is using SignWriting images from Delegs.
    Valerie Sutton
    @signwriting_twitter
    Good morning, Steve and everyone - I am here. Look forward to chatting with you in around 30 minutes! ;-)
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    I'm glad people still like the ISWA 2010 HTML Reference. You can view it online or download it. https://signbank.org/iswa https://signbank.org/iswa.zip
    Argonist
    @Argonist
    Thanks @Slevinski for iswa.zip. It is fantastic that Google released the Noto Sans SignWriting Regular font. First step outside of iswa team to release sign writing font. The facial diacritics is hot topic at us, too. Sign writing without face or empty face is all right, that is my opion.
    Argonist
    @Argonist
    The new delegs project may start on 1th july and must be firstly confirmed by federal government on end of may or start of june. It takes 4 years. Also the deaf owned IT-company will host that project and work with university of landhut and FAW (Advanced Training Academy for Economics GmbH). After Confirmation we will support your fanastic work. I will talk with my workmates about the parteon campaign.
    Argonist
    @Argonist
    Yes we, delegs 3 team (acutal project until march 2022), are working with sign2mint-team and creating a lot of SignWriting images for sign2mint. We will implement a new feature "Search by sign" soon. I compared the "Seach by sing" feature at sign puddle v2 and sign puddle v3 and figured out, that v2 searchs with symbol-ID and v3 searchs with SWU (Unicode). Can you tell me why did you change between v2 and v3? Have you problem with symbol-ID? delegs implemented sign writing always with symbol-ID and we are discussing, if we change from symbol-ID to unicode.
    Argonist
    @Argonist
    Sorry I dont understand with Option two (SWU). In which block SWU is used? (U+1D800 - U+1D9FF), right? If I put U+1D800 in SWU Input, then it will not show the expected symbol.
    If put U+40001, then it will show teh expected symbol. Is U+40001 in SWU, or?
    There are not SWU in ISWA 2010: https://steveslevinski.me/#standard2010, right?
    Argonist
    @Argonist
    The font file is big (about 3MB). The loading for website is too long, or? Do you know that problem?
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Formal SignWriting in ASCII (FSW) was released in 2012. It uses symbol IDs like S10000. https://steveslevinski.me/#standard2012
    SignWriting in Unicode (SWU) was released in 2017. It uses Plane 4 for the Sutton SignWriting symbols with characters like U+40001. SWU overwrites the Sutton SignWriting Block (U+1D800 - U+1D9FF) with structural markers and number characters. https://steveslevinski.me/#standard2017
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    FSW and SWU represent the same information and contains everything needed to define a sign. There is an easy conversion back and forth. The new sutton-signwriting/core package has a convert module with several functions to help swu2key, key2swu, swu2fsw, fsw2swu. https://sutton-signwriting.github.io/core/#convertswu2key
    I love FSW for the simplicity of ASCII. Unfortunately, it's not the best character string for using with a font.
    I love SWU for the visual representation of the one-dimensional string. Unfortunately, it requires using UTF-16 for JavaScript, but I think it's worth the tradeoff.
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    SWU is easier to use with fonts. The one-dimensional font is production ready. We have a proof-of-concept two dimensional font using Graphite. I have a development plan for the two-dimensional font using the Universal Shaping Engine. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Project/slevinski/ASL_Wikipedia_2-D_Font_Development_for_SignWriting
    SignWriting fonts are usually large. They can be installed on Windows, Linux, and iOS. If they are not installed, they can be loaded when needed with a font-face declaration in CSS.
    Argonist
    @Argonist

    SignWriting in Unicode (SWU) was released in 2017. It uses Plane 4 for the Sutton SignWriting symbols with characters like U+40001. SWU overwrites the Sutton SignWriting Block (U+1D800 - U+1D9FF) with structural markers and number characters. https://steveslevinski.me/#standard2017

    Ahh Understand. Thank you

    FSW and SWU represent the same information and contains everything needed to define a sign. There is an easy conversion back and forth. The new sutton-signwriting/core package has a convert module with several functions to help swu2key, key2swu, swu2fsw, fsw2swu. https://sutton-signwriting.github.io/core/#convertswu2key

    Fine. I need that convert-tool. thank you

    Yes we, delegs 3 team (acutal project until march 2022), are working with sign2mint-team and creating a lot of SignWriting images for sign2mint. We will implement a new feature "Search by sign" soon. I compared the "Seach by sing" feature at sign puddle v2 and sign puddle v3 and figured out, that v2 searchs with symbol-ID and v3 searchs with SWU (Unicode). Can you tell me why did you change between v2 and v3? Have you problem with symbol-ID? delegs implemented sign writing always with symbol-ID and we are discussing, if we change from symbol-ID to unicode.

    What is your opion with search sign via symbol-ID or SWU?

    Argonist
    @Argonist

    SWU is easier to use with fonts. The one-dimensional font is production ready. We have a proof-of-concept two dimensional font using Graphite. I have a development plan for the two-dimensional font using the Universal Shaping Engine. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Project/slevinski/ASL_Wikipedia_2-D_Font_Development_for_SignWriting

    Is that project with Graphite starting? I see that the project is not seleceted by Wikimedia.

    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    The graphite prototype is explained here: http://signpuddle.net/iswa/#smartfont
    The Universal Shaping Engine font was not selected by Wikimedia. That is the best writeup I have of the project. I have several projects to finish first, but I plan to revisit the USE font in 2022.
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    Searching FSW or SWU is easy with regular expressions. The Sutton SignWriting core library should be very helpful. The fswquery and swuquery modules are used for searching FSW and SWU respectively. https://github.com/sutton-signwriting/core
    The SignWriting Stream has a four-part playlist for the core package. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLMuQNdQ2lzl5nf6rOIGWOCNXOVP0GX0PN
    Argonist
    @Argonist
    Thank you for your comments
    Argonist
    @Argonist

    I'm glad people still like the ISWA 2010 HTML Reference. You can view it online or download it. https://signbank.org/iswa https://signbank.org/iswa.zip

    Is there die data of ISWA 2010 HTML Reference in sql-format for sqlite3? If no, then I must create a convert program to parse all html-files and insert into db oder create in csv-file.

    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    The data lives on, but in different formats. There should be a good chunk here: http://signpuddle.net/iswa/data/
    I never open sourced the HTML Reference creation scripts. That was several computers and several servers ago. I might be able to find creation scripts on a backup. I'll check again this weekend.
    Argonist
    @Argonist
    http://signpuddle.net/iswa/data/. There are no path to png-file.
    Steve Slevinski
    @Slevinski
    The real life hands are here: http://signpuddle.net/iswa/hand1.zip