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    Siarhei Ladzeika
    @ladeiko
    @petersirka Hi
    Ali PIÇAKCI
    @picakciali
    hi
    hi
    Christian Lagerkvist
    @lgrkvst
    Hi! I've newly taken an interest in totaljs. Is there like a vision statement or roadmap for the project somewhere?
    David J. Kordsmeier
    @truedat101
    @lgrkvst looks like this is where you wan to to look: https://blog.totaljs.com/blogs/business/20180801-total-js-platform-has-a-new-direction/ (very high level). I'm not sure where the detailed release roadmap lives, but rest assured, the project has regular releases, issues fixed quickly, and very accessible leadership, plus my favorite: not too many external dependencies to break your back with every new release.
    I'm a little confused about the commercial aspects of the project, however, I guess this is an approach to make the OSS aspects sustainable.
    Christian Lagerkvist
    @lgrkvst
    My guess too, and a sound pivot. I think the js ecosystem is reaching a point where vendors cannot charge for their tools anymore.
    David J. Kordsmeier
    @truedat101
    There's the camp that must track whatever the "it" framework is at the moment (express -> angular -> react -> vue -> ... ) and the camp that must have some commercial support option with training and documentation and devs that can be hired who know the framework. And then there's the let's used the best tool for the job camp. I think if you are jumping into total.js you'll find that it's easy to pick up and very possible to get someone trained up to use it very quickly if they are comfortable reading the total.js examples library of code on github.
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka
    Hi community communicates on https://messenger.totaljs.com ... it's not free but 8 EUR per year is not much :) ... Roadmap is about Marketplace, Products, Tutorials and better documentation. I improve Total.js platform step-by-step, currently is prepared a new release of Total.js v3.1.0 but I'm testing it...

    I'm a little confused about the commercial aspects of the project, however, I guess this is an approach to make the OSS aspects sustainable.

    Don't worry. OSS is the priority for the platform. I have a lot of projects built on Total.js, so Total.js can't end in bad hands. I'll continue because it's my work and hobby together.

    Peter Širka
    @petersirka

    I think the js ecosystem is reaching a point where vendors cannot charge for their tools anymore.

    Not really... Total.js Flow is used in big industry in Slovakia --> 40 M EUR net revenue or OpenPlatform is currently deployed for the first financial customer (revenue +27 mil. EUR) or health service or police. I have a lot of projects but I can't speak about them. Trust me :)

    David J. Kordsmeier
    @truedat101
    I'm using it for all of my commercial projects, as a replacement for my own web framework. I guess the trick is how to figure out how to translate users into support $ and donations. It's a bit different, because other frameworks mentioned (angular, react, and express) all had commercial entities promoting them and they don't really need to turn a profit, because open source keeps people in their ecosystems.
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka
    I agree, Total.js needs only promotion. Nothing more.
    Christian Lagerkvist
    @lgrkvst
    Is there any info/tutorial on how to integrate flow into an existing, non-totaljs, node.js web app?
    Christian Lagerkvist
    @lgrkvst

    community communicates on https://messenger.totaljs.com ... it's not free but 8 EUR per year is not much :)

    Not much, true, but first I need to know what I'm getting myself into without investing too much time. I haven't been able to find any tutorials on how the eco-system hangs together, how to integrate flow or dashboard with existing projects, how the products co-exist and interact (such as calling CMS templates from flow workflows), how to make flow execute in a larger js context such as a web app, how to implement new CMS themes, how to integrate jcomponents (without learning Angular), or how to access node machines from flow.

    It's pretty basic stuff but also pretty steep if you're new to the eco system. I guess what I'm missing is something like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KH5E2TL-_e8. Slow-paced, talking, explaining and building.

    David J. Kordsmeier
    @truedat101
    om g - what are node machines ....
    David J. Kordsmeier
    @truedat101
    I agree - I don't know too many other OSS communities that don't promote an open support forum as 1st tier of support. I certainly am not disputing the value of the paid group on messenger.totaljs.com. This is a bit of a vicious cycle. Total.js needs promotion. Not a lot of SO posts about total.js so the quick "google for a totaljs answer" doesn't usually come up with a useful result. But people won't be talking about it on SO if they don't use it, or don't perceive there's a community on SO responding to questions. I'm on another OSS project where there is a support forum and it captures 99% of the web traffic related to the project, but that also means the SEO of the project is bad, because nearly everything else is better for SEO: github, Stack overflow, hacker news, etc. Not complaining, just pointing out my observation of how communities grow. Perception is often different from reality.
    Christian Lagerkvist
    @lgrkvst

    Ok, I've given totaljs a couple of days and I give up. The learning curve is simply too steep. There's lots of help with installation and getting predefined boilerplates up and running – it's the next step that's missing. I can find no documentation whatsoever on switching CMS themes, adding text to a page in the CMS (shouldn't need documentation), connecting flows to dashboard graphs (got a static text working) or connecting Page renderer for that matter.

    With that, I wish the project all the luck. Flow is one of the most awesome js tools I've seen, and with the proper documentation (and overall a language overhaul) I'm confident it might turn out to be a really big deal in the js ecosystem.

    Pedro Maia Costa
    @pnmcosta

    Hi Christian, yes, learning curve is steep, but IMO not as bad as I've come across before. I think you maybe looking at too much at the same time, let me try and do an overview of Total.js in my experience (I have several live projects with it, see https://pmc.digital for more info):

    1. Total.js itself, is a development framework similar to what C# and the .net world is, it has 0 dependencies and all you need to start using it is to do npm install total.js, have your script require('total.js') and you're ready to use everything it includes.
    2. jComponents is a front end framework (jquery on steroids), it is very confusing if you're looking at the products GitHub (CMS or Flow) to distinguish this from the framework itself, but the new https://wiki.totaljs.com/ helps differentiating this.
    3. Flow and CMS (and others) are products built using Total.js. Flow is great for data transfer, but not necessarily to build websites with, CMS does exactly what is says on the tin (regarding your specific question, there's is no theme switch in the backend, but you can use a configuration key to indicate the theme you'll be using for the site, there is no multi site support at the moment) but do bear in mind that the /admin is a Single Page Application that uses jComponents for routing, etc.
    4. Documentation is 99% technical, there's a lot in there, specifically https://docs.totaljs.com when looking for methods/properties, but the new wiki as mentioned before helps explaning how it all goes together.

    If you'd like to give it a go again, don't hesitate to contact me on https://messenger.totaljs.com, Peter (the creator) is always there too, and even if you're not Premium yet, you'll be able to read previous conversations too.

    Eugene
    @eugenok_twitter
    hi all, just trying to install both eshop and cms on the same host, using defaul_root config option. but after that I get login page only.
    hor example default_root : /cms/, and after that path lead me to thelogin pageand not to cms, all other pathes lead to "not found"
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka
    Hi @eugenok_twitter it won't work. CMS and Eshop aren't optimized for same hostname, in other words: they don't support default_root. So you need to run each app on different domain/subdomain.
    M ABD AZIZ ALFIAN
    @aalfiann
    @petersirka I build rest api with totaljs, I use example rest api from github totaljs example and didn't found how to set custom http status 404 if the query is not found?
    M ABD AZIZ ALFIAN
    @aalfiann
    @petersirka finally I found the way how to do it. I able to change the response status with res.status = 404.
    M ABD AZIZ ALFIAN
    @aalfiann
    Is there
    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Totaljs seems to be a fresh way for Nodejs Apps. Trying CMS app but it does not use AJAX causing blinked page traveling => Can we improve this?
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka
    Hi @PeterKieu. It's because of SEO. I don't see any problem to render pages via AJAX, but it's needed to update layout by adding support for dynamic calling.
    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Hi @petersirka. I am working on backend APIs, and designing system architectures but total fresh man in NodeJs and Total.js. I love the terms " superfast & no dependencies of Total.js"
    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Total.js framework may be my front-ends for my big data, WebRTC Eco-system. How to reduce your 2-month learning curve to 1 week? Do you have high performance tuning use-case (e.g Total.js Messenger with one millions concurrence users; docker clustering...) Thanks much
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka

    You can't fool time (I think). Big cases need big solutions. With Total.js you can do everything but the apps must be optimized (e.g. Total.js Messenger can't be used for thousand of users because it's optimized for hundred of users). Very important is the entire architecture / design and maybe the framework is the last item in the chain.

    • Total.js supports cluster or can be used in specific cluster like server-less app
    • concurrence depends on many factors, e.g. WebSocket has limits and you will need serveral instances of apps for milions of users

    It's a pity that we don't have any similar case in our country :-D ... Wisdom says: everything starts with small details, first was wheel and then car. I can say for sure that Total.js Platform is very good platform for development of web apps (my opinion: it's the best). I work on Total.js Platform everyday and more than 6 years.

    Let me know if you need help.

    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Yes, I see. Nodejs is low rank for for back-end API (https://www.techempower.com/benchmarks/#section=data-r18&hw=ph&test=fortune) I am building enough things behind the scene (Cache, queue, real-time stream systems... with private cloud infrastructure). OK, I will create a test bed with Total.js apps, but it takes times to replace embedded NoSQL, back-end ajax calls...
    Your creation of Total.js is incredible! I don't like Express, jQuery and lot of misc, low-performance Node modules, widgets.
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka

    Nodejs is low rank for back-end API

    Not exactly true. Techempower doesn't contain redeemable values because each author of the "framework"/"technology" optimizes the example for the best performance. But the real cases aren't only Hello world apps, there are a lot of small details like database, business logic, sessions, etc.. As I said: framework is the last thing in the chain of some architecture. I agree that a good technology can save a lot of time.

    I don't like Express, jQuery and lot of misc

    I too, but our client-side library jComponent uses jQuery, but the result is unbelievable: https://componentator.com ... I could replace jQuery but I didn't see any benefit.

    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Today, tuning high perf in backend quite easy than front end app like your work
    Thus my reason in finding new solution to replace Node express, java spring mvc etc
    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Security! That is the headacle thing for frontend frameworks.
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka
    Great! We'd like to help you with some problems in Total.js.
    anhnhoktvn
    @anhnhoktvn
    Hi, I'm interested this the framework. However, after I skim through the source code, I was surprised that it has a few (really big!) files and a few comments! For example, the index.js file has 19047 lines (15541 sloc) !!! I wonder do you code everything in such a big file? how could you manage modules? And seriously, as a new comer, how could I easily understand your source code and how could I contribute?
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka

    Hi @anhnhoktvn

    • yes, index.js is too big, but not much (it's because of historical reasons)
    • but really I don't see any problem with a larger files. Because all files are still compiled into the memory ... so it doesn't matter if you have 30 small files or big one (I think that larger file saves a bit memory because each js file is independent module (object), but yes - it's important for clarity and I hate disarranged spaghetti code too
    • framework is collected from modules but index.js contains a core of the main funcionallity (I know each line of code and I understand it)
    • contribution isn't about the modifing source-code only, you can contribute documentation or create tutorials, blog posts, etc.. (you're welcome)

    Good to know: you don't need to understand fully source-code, it's complicated for developers who don't have advanced experience with Total.js... You need to understand my thinking and design of Total.js. If you understand then you win. Trust me and trust the framework, I work on it everyday more than 5 years. I have a great team of developers. Let me know if you have any questions.

    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Source code file size is nothing compared to images but we can optionally optimize for release mode like jQuery 😊
    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    @petersirka Can TotalJs CMS support multi language content?
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka

    @PeterKieu yes, but it's a bit complicated. You need to specify https://docs.totaljs.com/latest/en.html#api~global~LOCALIZE and then you can define language directly in Page settings. I think that better is to divide URL of pages according language:

    • /en/
    • /de/
    • /sk/

    with creating of custom template for each language :-)

    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Thanks much @petersirka I have interested things to-do to go-live Total.js WebApps (CMS, Messenger, Flow): 1. Firebase DB migration 2. Multi-language ... Total.js Flow shows off many idea applications :)
    To make Total.js better, I found this article: https://blog.jayway.com/2015/04/13/600k-concurrent-websocket-connections-on-aws-using-node-js/ in which I can use high performance websocket https://github.com/websockets/ws
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka
    @PeterKieu Total.js supports websocket similar to ws ... It's optimized for the best performance too. About concurrrent connections, you can do it with Total.js too, but it depends what do you want to do with app. Nothing more :-)
    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    @petersirka Can you add Firebase DB for any CMS/eshop/openplatform? That is extremely worthy core value for Totaljs
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka
    @PeterKieu no, this is not possible. OpenPlatform uses PostgreSQL and CMS/EShop NoSQL embedded. Our apps aren't open for any database, they are optimized for the specific DB engine.
    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    Ok, we see. Because you are the author who keeps all rights. But it can limit community innovation on lovely Totaljs ecosystem to make it stronger and more popular like Koa, Strapi... OSS projects. We hesitate to join Totaljs and contribute more design patterns, on-product use cases
    PeterKieu
    @PeterKieu
    My idea is that You can open your business with Firebase on Totaljs.
    Peter Širka
    @petersirka
    Yes, I agree - but we optimize products for our cases only - to end users (end users paid development). We don't like dependencies because dependencies can be hell in some critical situations. I don't mean dependencies from NPM, I mean external services.